that he hadn’t had those conversations. Pence went on the Sunday shows denying that Flynn and Kisiliak had done so based on what Flynn told him. The Russians knew that both Flynn, and by extension, Pence were lying and had that info to blackmail Flynn as DNI if they wanted to use it. This is why Orange said Flynn was fired for lying BOTH to the FBI and to Pence. This is also why the lie was material to an ongoing counter intelligence operation which (contrary to Cole) hadn’t been closed when Flynn and the Russian talked.
In addition Flynn had no right to give the Russians advice on how to respond to the sanctions which had to include at least a tacit suggestion that they would be revisited and dealt with more favorably when Orange took office. The Russians of course took his advice which Orange then praised.