I think everyone can guess my answer.
I'm curious to hear what everyone thinks about this. My frame of reference is around 1990, I imagine there were some pretty good players in the 70's.
I'm talking strictly in college, try your best not to factor in pro career. For example, Tony Rice was probably better than Montana in college.
So let's hear it.
Great Question - the answer is easy - Ross Browner - and I am not sure it is even close
I can't take credit for this part - edited from wiki -
Ross Browner was one of the most decorated defensive players in the history of college football - he was a four-year starter at defensive end, he was a unanimous All-America in his junior and senior seasons and won the Outland trophy and was named UPI Lineman of the Year twice. He won the Lombardi Trophy and the Maxwell Award as the nation's best player (only lineman to do so). He was fifth in voting for the Heisman Trophy. He was featured on the cover of Sports Illustrated with the subheading of "Notre Dame's Peerless Ross Browner." His career statistics record 340 tackles, a school record; ten deflected passes, two blocked kicks. He also scored a touchdown and two safeties.
Jerome never got to play his best position in the pros. Talk about Rocket as a DC's nightmare...how about a FB who's good for 6.0 YPC on simple dive plays? Makes everyone on the team better.
Someone below said Page, and that gave me pause, because I saw Page in college and he really tore it up, but I think he is slightly outside the 50-year parameter.
against Stanford.
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Hon Mention
Jeff S.
Quinn
Te'o
Jaylon
Tuck
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had he not left early, ND may have finished much higher his senior year.
He was greatly missed.
GO IRISH
I believe he is still the single-season and career record holder.
Keep in mind though that I don't think they started tracking sack stats until the 80s, so know one knows how many Ross Browner had.
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Reggie Bush and Vince Young reminded me of him...not in style of play, but in how other teams had to account for their presence on the field.
Everyone was afraid of him and everyone wanted to have him.
He gets downgraded because he lacked big time stats, but that was the nature of the offense.
Ty Detmer winning the Heisman over him was just as bad as that criminal clipping penalty that wiped out one of the most clutch plays in college football history.
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Still rushing yards AND TDs leader for a single season.
Guy was money!
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Tim Brown had a better pro career obviously, but not the college career or impact in every game that the Rocket had. Unfortunatley Rocket was unable to show as much in the pros because of injuries, and bad teams. Troy Aoikman once said that he never saw such a fast receiver run such precise patterns. So people knew, he just was not as lucky as a pro and going to Canada first was a dumb, dumb move.
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I doubt he regrets going to Canada at all. The NFL had a rookie salary cap at the time, and he made much more money in Canada than he would have in the NFL his first 2 seasons.
The only problem with Rocket's NFL career (he had two 1,000 yard seasons) was that he tore his ACL in 2000, which ended his career right when he was finally adapting to the pro game.
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I was 9. We had a bunch of people over and I was screaming he was going to bring it back. Then Rocket gave the thumbs up and I was certain. Rest is history. When they called the penalty I went into my room and cried. Or it was my sisters room. Either way, those fuckers cheated.
Some things about that play:
It looks like they had a punt block on, but then Colorado took a delay of game. You see #27 run over and look to the bench then run back and give instructions to the team. Holtz then screams at Rocket to let him know they are going to know try and return it. The thumbs up was a confirmation he got the instruction.
#34 Chad Brown, future NFL linebacker, gets a clear shot at him and hits him square. Rocket bounces right off like a pin ball.
The alleged clip is borderline. The ref it happens right in front of lets it go. The other ref further away and from a worse angle calls it.
He hit him front and to the side. To this day the worst call I think ever against ND given the circumstances, although the phantom "pick" against FSU in 2014 is close.
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fortunately you limited it to the last 50 years, instead of 65, or we could have chosen from about half of the CFB Hall of Fame inductees. Someone special to me played on the early to mid-90s teams. Without even asking him, I'd bet he say the Rocket, followed quickly by the Bus, Burris, Carter and Taylor. As I recall, 15-16 members of his class played in the NFL, as did 8 of the ten or so DBs during that time. It was the greatest assembly of talent at ND since 1966 and then the '46-'47 crew, which SI called the greatest collection of CFB talent in history in a 2005 special edition. The '66 team was loaded with NFL talent, especially on defense. My pick from that era would be Jim Lynch. The mid-seventies was yet another gold mine. While Joe deserves big kudos, Clements, Browner and Bradley were from a different planet. I played pickup with Tom C. and he was unbelievably quick and one of the most intense competitors I've seen. There would have been no NCs in '73 and '77 w/o our QBs.
Despite our recent struggles, we are truly blessed to claim such a legacy. And it can repeat.
Can there be any doubt?
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I would personally go with the Rocket for best player of the last 50, but Seymour belongs on a list of the top 25 for the same time frame,
Tim Brown, Rocket and Manti
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Allen Pinkett, Samardzija.
Probably not at the level of the guys above, but for LBs, Ned Bolcar, Michael Stonebreaker and Demetrius DuBose were all outstanding in their own ways and would have to be on any list of the best players of the past 50 years.
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Link: https://youtu.be/pT9xW8fnj8I
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college player and the kind everyone loved to root for.
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500+ yards in the rain against SC. There's a reason Montana could never get the job outright for a whole season and it's not because Devine had a vendetta against him. Like every coach, he just wanted to win games. Montana was inconsistent.
When people list Joe Montana as the greatest or among the greatest ND quarterbacks, it tells me they're basing it on his pro career, not his time at ND.
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While I agree with your assessment that Theisman was the better college quarterback, Montana was still a very good college quarterback while at Notre Dame. I have watched ND football for over 60 years, and the two best quarterbacks that I have seen at ND were Paul Hornung and Joe Theisman. One was a Heisman trophy winner and the other was a Heisman trophy runner up.
While I agree with your assessment that Theisman was the better college quarterback, Montana was still a very good college quarterback while at Notre Dame. I have watched ND football for over 60 years, and the two best quarterbacks that I have seen at ND were Paul Hornung and Joe Theisman. One was a Heisman trophy winner and the other was a Heisman trophy runner up.
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...he did have a kickoff return for a touchdown back in 1990 against Navy.
Link: http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/todd-lyght-1.html
Burris is basically a slightly better version of Zibby. Played offense, scored more touchdowns, and had more picks. Also returned a punt for a TD.
He was a great player for sure, but I'd put all these guys easily ahead of Zibby:
Bobby Taylor
Todd Lyght
Jeff Burris
Shane Walton
Harrison Smith
Pat Terrell
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versus Purdue, I watched him each play from my end zone seats. Footwork was horrible and he got beat horribly all four downs.
Ronnie Stanley, Zach Martin, Aaron Taylor, Andy Heck, Mirko Jurkovic, Tim Ruddy...Sam Young was nowhere near as good as those guys.
Ross Browner was a giant among college kids. He was the most noticeable player on defense, being essentially a one man wrecking crew.
Most defensive ends are specialists, that some are more geared towards run stopping, some are more geared towards pass rushing, and some even specialize in coverage skills. Browner was one of the rare defensive ends who could do it all. In many of those video highlights of his play, you would see him forklifting offensive linemen, literally picking them up and throwing them out of the way. Never mind the sheer number of fullbacks he either juked around, or plowed over.
You would also see him running down a tailback sweeping to the other side of the field, even though the running back had quite a head start.
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I have stated on this and other boards my belief that Browner is the greatest ND football player I have seen in my 60 years of watching ND football. I don't want to use the old "and it is not even close" line as there have been a lot of great ND players, but he clearly stands out ahead of any other ND player I have seen. The guy simply dominated the game on defense. Just a fabulous football player who was a star the moment he first walked onto the field as a true freshman.
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No Irish player in my memory controlled what the other side did as much as Browner.
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out to be voted the best tight end of the decade, I think the 80's in the pros. He was absolutely clutch, people forget about his big third down catch against Alabama between two defenders when we were driving for the lead because it got overshadowed by Weber's catch.(The only one of his that season I believe.)
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college and pros, of all time. He also has the ignominious distinction of being the guy to be "gifted" the Heisman the year they did a royal hose job on Jim Brown. Forget about the same sentence, Hornung doesn't even belong in the same novel as Jim Brown.
Hornung is in both the College Football and Pro Football Hall of Fames, yet is overrated in your opinion. What is the basis of your argument - that Hornung was not as good as Jim Brown. Jesus man, Jim Brown is probably the greatest player of all time. By this reasoning, everyone who has ever played football is overrated because they are not as good as Jim Brown.
While not the greatest player in ND history - in my opinion that honor belongs to either Ross Browner, Johnny Lujack or Leon Hart, but Hornung was clearly one of the greatest players in ND history.
Not the greatest but one of the most solid all around players ever. He and Frank Gifford were two of the best all around players in the pros., and Hornung was better.
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Believe it or not I thought Ned Bolcar and Manti were the next best. Bolcar was a stop in your tracks hitter and tackler, who had enough finesse to return a TD after an interception against Miami in 1989 in a game that he tied up with that play. That play changed the whole attitude of the team and we were outplaying them until the overrated Derek Brown ran a piss poor pattern and caused an interception because the linebacker covering him was able to cut off the angle because of his lazy rather than sharp pattern.
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And the punt return against Colorado with the "mystery clip" is still the greatest single play I've ever seen, given the situation in the game.
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I would say:
1) Rocket
2) Teo
3) Tim Brown
4) Tony Rice
5) Jaylon Smith
6) Brady Quinn
7) Chris Zorich
8) Will Fuller
9) Bettis
10) Aaron Taylor
Honorable mentions: Bryant Young, Shark, Julius Jones, Bobby Taylor, Shane Walton, Ronnie Stanley, Zack Martin, Justin Tuck, Golden Tate, Tyler Eifert, Michael Floyd, Frank Stams, Stonebreaker, Todd Lyght
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McDougal had 1 good year on a great team. He's one of my favorites, but not in the same league as the other guys.
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I realized after I posted I forgot Bettis and had to change it. Probably forgetting someone else.
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wrong spot
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Definitely deserves honorable mention.