Comrade Trumpsky and his fellow traitors will split the scum Republicans.
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Did I leave anything out? The mention of "abortion" will cause R politicians to run and hide. The Ds hit heavy on misinformation and lies (anyone surprised) about the court ruling for their ads and very very few Rs stood up and were counted with the truth. They ran. They hid. They turned their yellow backs on the little unborn. Most Rs are just Ds but haven't declared it yet. We had Rs walking with the BLM protests a couple of years ago. See Romney, R Texas congressman Will Hurd, and my own Indiana Senator Mike Braun. The uni-party is alive and well. I respect that old woman Mitch McConnell as much as I respect the current socialist pope. And you can easily compare the Bishops and Cardinals of the Holy Church to the members of congress. Both will tell you exactly who they are and not lose any sleep over it.
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note that you don't hold a monopoly on morality, ELP.
Link: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/05/23/like-americans-overall-catholics-vary-in-their-abortion-views-with-regular-mass-attenders-most-opposed/
My morality on this issue comes from God Himself. Not from some poll. My life is not directed by polls as apparently yours is. "I knew you when you were in your mother's womb". You think this is an episode from West Wing?
be turned "ON" at any time, at the whim of any random male, be it by rape, incest or abusive spouse...and live with the consequences.'
Does that help you understand what's going on around you? That sarcastic statement of mine is exactly what people like you and Ned are advocating.
You made a statement, said the statement was sarcastic and then said people advocate for the sarcastic statement that you made.
You said that ELP and Ned advocate for random men to be able to make babies with women by raping them.
Why do you keep posting? You are terrible at it.
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what I said is the truth and the vast majority of people in this country agree...you're just slowing down real progress toward reducing the fundamental causes of 'Unwanted Pregnancies", and hence abortions.
God will not judge this issue on what the vast majority thinks. All thanks to you you you and your Naperville /Cape Cod ladies auxiliary, murdered unborn little ones will never have the opportunities you have had all your white privileged lives. It doesn't even penetrate your thick skulls that these abortion clinics are set up in poor communities and guess who their target audience is? Grow a pair and start acting like a man by being the protector of the weak and innocent.
consequences of all rape, incest and abusive spouse pregnancies...now and forever?
Would that satisfy all the pro-abortion bloodlust?
circumstances abortions should be legalized...is that correct?...
I'll address the other conditions after you agree or disagree.
You don't even realize you're not as brilliant as you think you are. We're all going to be judged one day. Me, you, everyone. Make sure you take all your poll data with you when it comes your time.
won't even enter into a conversation about this topic that is so central to the whole abortion issue. What are you so afraid of?...
PR strategy. Supreme court ruling is not about pro life, pro choice. But D campaigns successfully changed the nature of this ruling and made pro-life vs pro-chice a major campaign issue, therefore mobilized their voters, just like you always changed the subject of the thread for your agenda.
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for the left, a loss of 60+ seats in Congress in midterm 2010 if I remember correctly.
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Dedication to the personal leader more important than values. Group identity more important than impartial justice. You guys are getting there.
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Trump was never a true pro-lifer. You could tell in his first interview on the subject that he had no understanding of the issue at all. It seemed like he thought the issue was unimportant, but he knew he had to pay lip service to it, and he was pretty bad at doing that.
He kept true to his word on SCOTUS nominees, though. So, that is nice.
Even if he changes position on the topic, he will still appoint better SCOTUS candidates than the Dems. Plus, he lashes out at everyone, at some point.
Abortion is, or should be, a state issue now, like all other homicide laws that don't involve border crossing.
So, I'm not sure why I should care.
If your point is that pro-life is a losing position politically, then again I have to ask why I should care. I'm not like you. I don't put party before issue. I'm not willing to support killing people so my party wins an election. Instead, I vote issues based on what is right, not based on how the issue will get my favorite party elected. I can see why you wouldn't understand an approach like that, though.
abortion issue represents much more to them than what the extremists in the Pro-Life movement characterize it as (killing)...i.e. they see the lack of concern for innocent women being forced to carry a pregnancy to term, followed by a lifetime of care, as irrational and cruel. That sentiment will never change, thereby creating a conundrum for the GOP...stay with that policy and lose general elections, or moderate and accept the legality of abortion choices everywhere...and say so.
Roe v Wade was bad law. Period.
The States have rights.
If the GOP suddenly supported abortion rights, and if the Democrats suddenly became pro-life, but all other political views were the same, which party would you support?
your question is irrational...BUT, to play along with you...I'd vote for legalized abortion in the manner in which Roe v. Wade was established...regardless of which party stood for it.
NOW...what is your response to my question?
Link: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/05/23/like-americans-overall-catholics-vary-in-their-abortion-views-with-regular-mass-attenders-most-opposed/
Would stay a member of the Democrat Party if they were pro-life, and if the GOP were pro-abortion?
Also, I asked what restrictions you would accept on abortion, if any?
"I'd vote for legalized abortion in the manner in which Roe v. Wade was established...regardless of which party stood for it."...in your parlance, "Pro-Choice"...
NOW, before we get to your additional questions, please...please...answer mine ;-). btw, those questions are very good ones and we'll certainly get to them...AFTER you answer my original inquiry...
I suspect you know this, and you are just trying to be difficult, while accusing me of same.
first I'll answer the question for you...
You know you have NO JUSTICE to offer women who are unjustly impregnated and that the vast majority of Americans believe abortion is justified in such cases because outright denial is untenable...but you also know that once you acknowledge that this is the right remedy, you can't claim "Murder" any longer...so, to protect your image as someone with the highest morality, your personal pride keeps you from "Going There" and trying to find 'common ground'...that's a shame...to hold onto a known wrong position and fail to seek a better one.
If you ever see the light, and truly want to compromise, I'll join you...
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Chris you have often said you don't care about the abortion issue. You post pretty vigorously in favor of it, so I have doubted you. But this indicates you meant that.
Let's see if Tyrone has the balls to answer.
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His mind is one track.
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Even if he is right, he offered a political judgement. Since your morals come from your politics (and not the other way around), I can see how you would think his political judgement would be important.
But, you have offered no reason why I should care about Trump's comment.
As to the point in the body of your post: There are many historical examples of the public supporting homicides of entire groups of people merely for what those people were. In every case, "the public" was wrong. You should care about that.
Saying that an abortion is a killing is not a moral statement, so it is not extremist. I called it a homicide, which is a killing of one person by another, regardless of intention or legality. It is a scientific fact that an abortion ends a human life, and the fact that it is caused by another human makes it a homicide. There is no moral judgement there at all. In fact, we allow legally ending human lives, intentionally, in at least three cases (capital crime convicts, self-defense, and innocent babies...I just argue that one of those is not like the others). We also do not punish people for accidental homicides in many cases. But, it is revealing that in only one case, people try to call a homicide not a homicide. Obviously you have some discomfort with abortion if you can't look at it, and call it what it is. If you have to look away, and use euphemisms, perhaps you should ask yourself why you do that?
The "lack of concern" argument is false. You obviously don't know pro-lifers. But, perhaps your point is that pro-lifers need to advertise their equal concern for the mother more broadly and successfully, and with that I agree.
In the end, though, your point is political: "a conundrum for the GOP." But, I am not concerned with that at all, so Trump's point doesn't concern me. I'm not willing to define a class of humans as killable just to get a party I like into political power. That makes me very unlike you. Indeed, I am willing to sacrifice many of my non-moral political values to achieve the moral goal of saving the lives of innocents.
aware of what abortion entails. They are making what is termed a "Prudential Judgement"...i.e. factoring all concerns...including the woman's...it is their moral judgement that the option of abortion needs to be legalized, everywhere....not unlike what has come to pass recently in highly Catholic countries like Ireland and Mexico.
The extreme Pro-Life advocates...such as yourself, apparently...offer no "Justice" for totally innocent women. Until you and your cohorts moderate your stance, you stand in the way of real progress on this issue...i.e. Contraception...Sex/Sexuality Education...Greater Funding for Child Care and Mothers...ALL of it.
I am, of course, worried that the US populace will make bad choices regarding the killing of a large group of innocent people. But, I've been living with that reality for decades.
pregnant due to rape, incest or abusive spouse?
The question above, and this one, which I have asked a half dozen times: What exceptions, if any, you would accept on abortion in non-rape, non-incest cases. You have refused to answer every time.
If you want to discuss, let's discuss. But, you avoid discussion when you get uncomfortable, and then you act like other people avoid discussion. I'm willing to answer your question. Are you willing to answer my questions?
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I've said I will answer if you will. You won't even say that to me. You are obviously scared of answering me more than you want to know my answer.
Once again, you act like you want to discuss, but when you are on questionable ground, you run away. I think we all see now that you are uncomfortable with your own position.
you can go back through 50 years of this country's history if you doubt me...now get on with it...what is your idea of "Justice" for totally innocent women/girls who become pregnant against their will through rape, incest of abusive spouses?
Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy
I won't hold my breath.
Again, I've said I stand ready to answer if you will. You won't even promise to answer me if I will answer you. You fear a full discussion of the issue because you know you are just being partisan, and not basing your position on a firm foundation of fact.
clammed up...some day you're gong to have to face up to it...why not now?
it means that you've extended the conversation well beyond his neural capacity. At this point, the only proper thing to do is to tell him fuck off.
Now he's posturing to extract himself from a trap.
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