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Horrifying, isn't it? Posting it per Elon's request. This explains why the left became warmongers

Author: Eli (9555 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 2:51 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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The left love state control which is why they love staying in power. Any war, war on terror, war on Russia, war on China or war on whatever would give them excuse to control technology, economy and even your personal life.

Btw, Marc Andreessen is a brilliant software engineer. Anyone here, if still remember Mosaic and Netscape, should remember him. He is a hall of famer of www.


Link: https://x.com/WallStreetApes/status/1868138972200739148

Replies to: Horrifying, isn't it? Posting it per Elon's request. This explains why the left became warmongers


Thread Level: 2

DEM efforts to maintain power have nothing to do with warmongering

Author: Curly1918 (16437 Posts - Joined: Aug 30, 2017)

Posted at 6:07 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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For decades they have been anti-war AND anti-military … and were the ones in favor of appeasing communist dictators. They enabled Putin’s aggression with their passive response.

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 3

BTW you mischaracterized cold war and Reagan's anti-communist strategy

Author: Eli (9555 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 8:10 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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In Cold war we fought to stop USSR from spreading communism ideology all over the world. Don't forget most African countries were socialism countries and well connected to and supported by USSR during 1960s and 1970s. The entire Egyptian army were equipped with USSR arms. The cold war is the war of capitalism against communism. USSR were aggressive in spreading communism ideology. US played defense to stop them. But cold war is not about democracy against dictatorship, as capitalism camp had many dictatorship countries too. Spain and Portugal in Europe, south korea, Taiwan, south Vietnam, Philippines in Asia Chile and most south American countries with military governments. They were dictatorship, but they also support capitalism and against communism. Under the dictator Pinochet's leadership and with help of Chicago school of economics, Chile achieved so called Chile Miracle in economy.

During cold war, many dictators fought communism, defended capitalism. They were US allies. That's the facts. Now D control MSM. MSM propaganda micharacterized cold war for the purpose of their agenda.


This message has been edited 2 time(s).

Thread Level: 4

As your ideological hero John Mearsheimer wrote in The Tragedy of Great Power Politics,

Author: Curly1918 (16437 Posts - Joined: Aug 30, 2017)

Posted at 8:46 am on Dec 16, 2024
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"Appeasement contradicts the dictates of offensive realism and, therefore, is a fanciful and dangerous strategy. It is unlikely to transform a dangerous force into a kinder, gentler opponent, much less a peace-loving state. Indeed, appeasement is likely to whet, not shrink, an aggressor’s appetite for conquest. … Because great powers are programmed for offense, an appeased state is likely to interpret a power concession by another state as a sign of weakness…The appeased stats are then likely to continue pushing for more concessions… In short, appeasement is likely to make a dangerous rival more, not less, dangerous." (p. 164)

Thread Level: 3

Traditionally R was peace mongering until W. D got us into WW I, II, Korean war, Vietnam War

Author: Eli (9555 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 7:26 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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W Bush is an exception. It's Trump who brings R back to its root. Just take a look at those iraq war supporters from R side. They either niw join D camp or are marginalized within R. But look at D party, their Iraq war supporters, i.e. those who voted yes to authorize president to start Iraq war, have been still very active and have played major roles within D party. Hillary 2016 and Biden 2020 are 2 examples. Both approved starting Iraq war back then.

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 4

The best way to avoid war is to make the cost too high for our enemies AND...

Author: Curly1918 (16437 Posts - Joined: Aug 30, 2017)

Posted at 8:09 am on Dec 16, 2024
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make it clear that we have no trepidation about using lethal force... like when Trump took out Soleimani

Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Qasem_Soleimani

Thread Level: 4

Bob Dole on warmongering D party during VP debate 1976.

Author: Eli (9555 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 7:31 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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(no message)

Link: https://youtu.be/6G9AePwl1AE?si=p4jYJWU_fRgHIHSq

Thread Level: 2

A health crisis offered the Left their best opportunity for taking control. And they magnified it w/

Author: BaronVonZemo (59855 Posts - Joined: Nov 19, 2010)

Posted at 4:00 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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Artificial stats and fear mongering. They had us Shut Down for a year longer than necessary at least.

In the process, the destroyed the credibility of the govt health agencies and stunted the education of our children in a way that will leave scars for a generation.

Fauci was their tool, and his price was fame, adulation, and money….lots of money. He has done more harm to the health of people than any doctor in the history of the world.


Thread Level: 3

Honest question..:

Author: Domer From Hell (16295 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 4:07 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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I know you’re a physician, so what would you have done to combat Covid?

Do you know anyone who died from it? Remember Killshot? He died of Covid and he was a denier too.


We're all born bald baby!
Thread Level: 4

I am no COVID denier nor am I an anti-vaxxer

Author: BaronVonZemo (59855 Posts - Joined: Nov 19, 2010)

Posted at 4:30 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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I would like to answer this now, but am unable to time wise do it Justice.

Nutshell:
The masks, social distancing, and shut down were BS. There was never scientific justification for it, and I said so.
I encouraged the vaccine for adults and those at risk regardless of age. There was no good data to ever say that healthy young children should get it (they had a higher risk from the vaccine than the COVID). There was never any data at all to suggest that the vaccine prevented spread but authorities lied to us all and used that false claim as a reason to FORCE people to get the vaccine (or lose their livelihood which gave them no choice).
I believe in the vaccine in the proper patient population, but I NEVER approve of coercion being used on anyone to get a shot that they don’t want….that is ASSAULT.

The medical community was mislead by officials, the country was intentionally feared with manipulated statistics (ex # of those who died FROM COVID. Vs # of those who died WITH COVID) and the appointment of politically selected people to re review charts and change diagnoses that the treating Dr’s made in order to juice numbers.

Fauci……he knew better….he even said so in a 60 Minutes interview before the politics became involved.

COVID is no joke, but it got used to persist with a SHUT DOWN long after it was known to be unnecessary because provided political opportunity for the Left.

Regarding what I would have done what we have always done and what Sweden did (and was saying that also).
Isolate the sick, not the healthy. No Shut Down past the first month or two to “blunt the curve” to prevent overwhelming hospitals.
Vaccine recommended for all adults and high risk people - but not forced on anyone.
No school closings past the “blunting of the curve”, no healthy general population mask wearing (placebos), no social distancing,
No false claims about the vaccine - just say….”we really aren’t sure, so we are going to be cautious about [insert whatever related topic] rather than lying.
No false statistics….same standards for all reporting and no changing diagnoses to fit a political need.

In other words….handle it much like we did H1N1.

I won’t even get into the data that has come out on PAXLOVID right now, but remove Pharma from such influence in the FDA CDC and NIH.


This message has been edited 3 time(s).

Thread Level: 5

I like your solution…

Author: Domer From Hell (16295 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 4:46 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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And I agree for the most part. One thing is that social distancing was effective. I’ve read that it reduced cases by 15-20%.

We're all born bald baby!
Thread Level: 6

Don't be misled by Baron...here's the truth (in bold text) vis-a-vis his misinformation and outright

Author: TyroneIrish (20401 Posts - Joined: Oct 8, 2020)

Posted at 8:40 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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lying...It'll take a bit of time to fill in, so bear with me through some "Edits"...
--------------------
Nutshell:
The masks, social distancing, and shut down were BS. There was never scientific justification for it, and I said so.
;I've shown the Forum...and Baron...studies that justify using Masks, SD and Shutdowns...two examples are (1) BVZ's own "MIT Study" that he posted which outlined how much time could be spent in a closed room...like a schoolroom...with various masks...(e.g. N95 vs. Cloth), and (2) a Real World Study of Schools in Boston who used masking during COVID and others who did not...Result: ...clear support for Masking in Schools, and using "Difference in Difference" statistical analysis

I encouraged the vaccine for adults and those at risk regardless of age. There was no good data to ever say that healthy young children should get it (they had a higher risk from the vaccine than the COVID). There was never any data at all to suggest that the vaccine prevented spread but authorities lied to us all and used that false claim as a reason to FORCE people to get the vaccine (or lose their livelihood which gave them no choice).
Any human being...at any age...can become infected with COVID...and Spread it to others...therefore, given the proven safety of our vaccines and the virulence of COVID, it makes perfect sense to recommend that all persons, regardless of age, get vaccinated...with the sole exception of those with 'contra-indications' for the vaccine...also, voluminous data has been published documenting the effectiveness of the COVID vaccines for a) reducing transmission and b) protection from serious illness or death...Baron is flat out lying here.

I believe in the vaccine in the proper patient population, but I NEVER approve of coercion being used on anyone to get a shot that they don’t want….that is ASSAULT.
Our government...national or local...has only required personnel to be vaccinated who are critically needed HC workers (Physicians, Nurses, Staff) or in roles like Police, Fire, Military, etc. so as to maintain order...keep public service functions operating...and the nation safe. This requirement is not Assault...it's a Prudent Measure to ensure the Public Good...Baron playing politics with the public's health.,/i>

The medical community was mislead by officials, the country was intentionally feared with manipulated statistics (ex # of those who died FROM COVID. Vs # of those who died WITH COVID) and the appointment of politically selected people to re review charts and change diagnoses that the treating Dr’s made in order to juice numbers.
There has never been a need to 'manipulate statistics' to convey the danger of COVID...studies have shown that the death rate of COVID vs Flu varied in the U.S. from a 1:1 ration for Hawaii, to between 3:1 and 7:1 for the rest of the country...plus the 'Contagion Rate' (R0) of COVID is much higher than the Flu. Note that on the Politics side of things, Florida, under RDS purposely left out deaths from COVID among all the "Snowbirds" living for months at a time in that state during the pandemic...thus skewing their data.

Fauci……he knew better….he even said so in a 60 Minutes interview before the politics became involved.
Dr. Fauci never uttered a falsehood regarding COVID...upon his retirement, he was lauded by members of the Infectious Disease Society of America for his tireless efforts to keep Americans and others around the world, safe from this disease...and those Physicians, Nurses, etc. in the IDSA don't suffer fools...(like Baron)...at all. I've addressed all of Baron's misstatements regarding Dr. Fauci and have no problem repeating them if asked.

COVID is no joke, but it got used to persist with a SHUT DOWN long after it was known to be unnecessary because provided political opportunity for the Left.
To suggest that COVID was USED for anything is a delusion. This was a global catastrophe and our HC agencies were totally focused on keeping all citizens a safe and healthy as possible. Baron appears to be evidencing some unknown psychological problems...one of which looks a lot like Paranoia, given his never ending "battle" against all things "Left"

Regarding what I would have done what we have always done and what Sweden did (and was saying that also).
Sweden had the highest death rate per capital of any Scandinavian country, and ended up having to ditch its "Open" strategy and employ its own Lockdowns and restrictions on group sizes indoors, etc.
Isolate the sick, not the healthy. No Shut Down past the first month or two to “blunt the curve” to prevent overwhelming hospitals.
Sounds like Baron echoing the "Great Barrington Declaration" which had NO PLANNING AT ALL for how to a) Identify all the "vulnerable" people, b) where to house them c) how to care for them, d) how long to continue the program, or e) how/how much to allot for funding this program...in the midst of a raging pandemic without any vaccines available...and no example of the strategy having ever been employed before...basically, a Fool's Errand, if not outright Insanity...

Vaccine recommended for all adults and high risk people - but not forced on anyone.
Explained above

No school closings past the “blunting of the curve”, no healthy general population mask wearing (placebos), no social distancing,
We've learned much from our School Closures/Openings...need to have vaccines available...need proper ventilation and social distancing...as well as Masking

No false claims about the vaccine - just say….”we really aren’t sure, so we are going to be cautious about [insert whatever related topic] rather than lying.
No Government Agency ever lied about COVID, which would require (like FOX News) Knowing the Truth but saying the opposite...didn't happen...another misstatement by Baron...assuming he knows the difference between what is true and false.

No false statistics….same standards for all reporting and no changing diagnoses to fit a political need.
Here we've learned that the U.S. reporting system is not where it needs to be...the CDC relied on state systems that varied greatly in how effective they were in gathering data...and then reporting it...case in point...some states were still using FAX machines to transmit/receive data...perhaps another example of Baron's Paronoia.,/i>

In other words….handle it much like we did H1N1.
Sounds a lot like Trump..."COVID is just like the Flu...it'll go away when the warm weather comes"

I won’t even get into the data that has come out on PAXLOVID right now, but remove Pharma from such influence in the FDA CDC and NIH.
PAXLOVID human testing was so successful that those tests were halted early in order to get the much needed treatment out to the public ASAP...apparently, Baron doesn't believe in the "Do No Harm" part of profession's oath.



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Thread Level: 7

As usual, your post is full of lies.

Author: jakers (13884 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 10:35 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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The federal government did NOT limit its mandate to Healthcare workers and "critical" roles. What a disgusting lie.

The left did abuse this for a power grab. Teachers Unions blocked reopening and leveraged against Charter and Private schools reopening until they could garner unrelated interests in a veritable hostage negot5. Warren Wilhelm held up N.Y.C. reopening while trying to redistribute wealth.

You're a liar.


Thread Level: 8

I included the phrase "...keep public service functions operating..", which covers many government

Author: TyroneIrish (20401 Posts - Joined: Oct 8, 2020)

Posted at 1:13 am on Dec 16, 2024
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employees and contractors who are hired to assist government operations...checkout the categories covered in the attached Wiki overview of COVID Mandates. Note that most of them have to do with HC workers, along with our military...as I stated. Also, there were Federal Mandates for OSHA employees.

As for school vaccination mandates they were issued by states and not all states imposed them. You are entitled to your opinion on why they were imposed, but protecting teachers from illness and possible death are the most logical, IMO.

btw, Baron made this statement regarding 'Mandates'...". but I NEVER approve of coercion being used on anyone to get a shot that they don’t want….that is ASSAULT.", and made no exceptions...even for critically needed HC workers, Police, Fire, Military and other vital government functions that impact citizens well being, both physical and economic. That's a formula inviting chaos in the face of a roaring deadly pandemic...in a word...Stupid.

Now, how about all the other claims Baron made that I addressed...don't be shy...challenge me.


Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_vaccination_mandates_in_the_United_States

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 9

Hilarious word games.

Author: jakers (13884 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 3:59 pm on Dec 16, 2024
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Every company that did any business with the U.S. Government was required to mandate the shot on their employees or fire them for non-compliance. That, by any reasonable measure, was overreach. The U.S. Supreme Court agreed.

I said nothing about states nor schools. That is another discussion.


Thread Level: 7

Your post is full of misconceptions. You're not a doctor, nor do you understand the science

Author: MarkHarman (7276 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 10:18 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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The Boston school masking "study" has been DEBUNKED. And you keep hanging your hat on this when you completely ignore reams of other school masking experiments that showed ZERO efficacy.

Statistically there is ZERO reason those in non-vulnerable populations should get a Covid vaccine.

Fauci lied repeatedly (he even admitted to three of them publicly). He also lied about funding for gain of function research. He lied about Covid origins through discovery of his own emails. I won't say he lied about HCQ+ although his flawed PERSONAL medical philosophy single-handedly shot down its widespread use as Dr. Fareed pointed out.

As for Paxlovid, you are obviously woefully behind in your knowledge. I know you like to use four-year-old links often, but this is 2024.

As for Sweden, you keep disingenuously comparing it to other Scandinavian countries but totally ignore it did better than many other European countries that fully masked and shut down. Why do you ignore that? And besides, Finland is now almost on a par with Sweden in Covid deaths, something you probably didn't know.

Ty, you're a good guy but your medical knowledge compared to Baron's is like a football score of 66-3. I've conversed with the guy in private and he's nothing short of brilliant. You have some sort of man-crush on the Great Fauchino that totally clouds your judgment. According to you, Drs. Risch, Fareed, Batchatarya, Prasad, McCullough, etc, all know nothing but Fauchino knows everything. But it's not really your fault as logic is a skill that escapes you so it's understandable.


This message has been edited 2 time(s).

Thread Level: 8

My responses...(in bold text)...

Author: TyroneIrish (20401 Posts - Joined: Oct 8, 2020)

Posted at 2:00 am on Dec 16, 2024
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The Boston school masking "study" has been DEBUNKED. And you keep hanging your hat on this when you completely ignore reams of other school masking experiments that showed ZERO efficacy.
>Challenged...not Debunked (i.e. Proven wrong)

Statistically there is ZERO reason those in non-vulnerable populations should get a Covid vaccine.
How do you know...for sure...that someone is not vulnerable...or will not spread the potentially deadly virus to someone who is?

Fauci lied repeatedly (he even admitted to three of them publicly). He also lied about funding for gain of function research. He lied about Covid origins through discovery of his own emails. I won't say he lied about HCQ+ although his flawed PERSONAL medical philosophy single-handedly shot down its widespread use as Dr. Fareed pointed out.
Not even Sen. Rand Paul has produced PROOF of Dr Fauci lying...and GOF is a highly nuanced term covering many techniques that include "Loss of Function"...I doubt that you know what you're talking about since Rand Paul doesn't seem to either.

As for Paxlovid, you are obviously woefully behind in your knowledge. I know you like to use four-year-old links often, but this is 2024.
I've seen the results of Human Testing with PAXLOVID...have you?...it worked exceedingly well...with no reports of it performing poorly...even in 2024 (I just checked)

As for Sweden, you keep disingenuously comparing it to other Scandinavian countries but totally ignore it did better than many other European countries that fully masked and shut down. Why do you ignore that? And besides, Finland is now almost on a par with Sweden in Covid deaths, something you probably didn't know.
Do a Board Search on "Sweden" with my username, and go to my post on 11/17/24 @5:37pm for my response regarding Sweden's LACK of success

Ty, you're a good guy but your medical knowledge compared to Baron's is like a football score of 66-3. I've conversed with the guy in private and he's nothing short of brilliant. You have some sort of man-crush on the Great Fauchino that totally clouds your judgment. According to you, Drs. Risch, Fareed, Batchatarya, Prasad, McCullough, etc, all know nothing but Fauchino knows everything. But it's not really your fault as logic is a skill that escapes you so it's understandable.
As I've noted before, I communicate with an Infectious Disease Specialist and a Pulmonary/Critical Care (e.g. ICU) Physician on the issues Baron talks about. Given that Baron is an OB/GYN Doc, they know much more than he does about all things COVID...they agree that Baron is a poor source of information and don't want to waste their time discussing anything he has to say. As I've said before, true professionals don't suffer fools. Finally, you're entitled to your opinion on my logic skills...I couldn't care less about that...but I do hope that things are working out for you.

Re: Baron...Just remember who showed concern for your cataract procedure, and who went on and on complaining about Ophthalmologists making more $$/hr than he did, before penning a sentence of best wishes...tells you something.


This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 9

Then let me talk to your vaunted ID doctor about HCQ+

Author: MarkHarman (7276 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 2:36 pm on Dec 16, 2024
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And I wager I know more about it than he does. What's his phone number or email address?

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 10

Go for it.

Author: TyroneIrish (20401 Posts - Joined: Oct 8, 2020)

Posted at 12:29 am on Dec 19, 2024
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(no message)

Thread Level: 8

Well said!

Author: jray (3338 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 11:00 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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(no message)

Thread Level: 6

Thnx-soc dist did NOT matter and Fauci admitted under oath that they simply made up the number 6 ft

Author: BaronVonZemo (59855 Posts - Joined: Nov 19, 2010)

Posted at 7:03 pm on Dec 15, 2024
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This choice of 6 ft made it impossible for schools to try to get back going since there was no way to physically accomplish this.
Fauci admits the pulled the number out of thin air in this video of his testimony under oath (starts about the 1:20 point). Different groups like the Teacher's Union had huge input as to what they wanted (Fauci references "labor unions).
The thing is that they didn't say that they were taking their best guess because then there would have been more push to get the kids back in school and church's open, etc..
Instead, they said that there was evidence....and you can see here after the fact, Fauci admits that there was never evidence for it at all.

With inevitable exposure to all, the only time that any distance would have been meaningful (if it was ever determined scientifically) would have been in the first 2 months to "blunt the curve" to prevent hospitals from being overwhelmed.
Beyond that, if it even did work, it would merely be slowing the development of herd immunity.


Link: https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=fauci%20lied%20social%20distancing&mid=41284BE7B26892E9D28641284BE7B26892E9D286&ajaxhist=0

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 2

What a hypocrite. You worship a warmonger and you praise autocrats worldwide…

Author: Domer From Hell (16295 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 3:43 pm on Dec 15, 2024
View Single

Just shut up, you Chicom piece of skunk cock.

We're all born bald baby!
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