Menu
UHND.com - Notre Dame Football, Basketball, & Recruiting UHND.com - Notre Dame Football, Basketball, & Recruiting

UHND.com - Notre Dame Football, Basketball, & Recruiting

UHND.com - Notre Dame Football, Basketball, & Recruiting UHND.com - Notre Dame Football, Basketball, & Recruiting
  • Football
    • 2024 Notre Dame Football Schedule
    • 2024 Notre Dame Roster
    • 2024 Notre Dame Coaching Staff
    • Injury News & Updates
    • Notre Dame Football Depth Charts
    • Notre Dame Point Spreads & Betting Odds
    • Notre Dame Transfers
    • NFL Fighting Irish
    • Game Archive
    • Player Archive
    • Past Seasons & Results
  • Recruiting
    • Commits
    • News & Rumors
    • Class of 2018 Commit List
    • Class of 2019 Commit List
    • Class of 2020 Commit List
    • Class of 2021 Commit List
    • Archives
  • History
    • Notre Dame Bowl History
    • Notre Dame NFL Draft History
    • Notre Dame Football ESPN GameDay History
    • Notre Dame Heisman Trophy Winners
    • Notre Dame Football National Championships
    • Notre Dame Football Rivalries
    • Notre Dame Stadium
    • Touchdown Jesus
  • Basketball
  • Forums
    • Chat Room
    • Football Forum
    • Open Forum
    • Basketball Board
    • Ticket Exchange
  • Videos
    • Notre Dame Basketball Highlights
    • Notre Dame Football Highlights
    • Notre Dame Football Recruiting Highlights
    • Notre Dame Player Highlights
    • Hype Videos
  • Latest News
  • Gear
  • About
    • Advertise With Us
    • Contact Us
    • Our RSS Feeds
    • Community Rules
    • Privacy Policy
  • RSS
  • YouTube
  • Twitter
  • Facebook
Home > Forums > The Open Forum
Login | Register
Upvote this post.
0
Downvote this post.

Finally, an adult take on the vaccine issue

Author: Nigel Tufnel (8035 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 9:23 am on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

From the WSJ

To summarize....get vaccinated, and the CDC needs to step up. 'Yet time and again in this pandemic the CDC has been a source of confusion or ineptitude. And Washington wonders why Americans have lost confidence in Covid experts.'

The CDC’s Delta Variant Panic
The agency spreads needless worry about vaccinations.

As the coronavirus evolves, so does the science. The Delta variant is creating uncertainty about how much vaccines prevent transmission, but the overwhelming evidence shows they are highly protective against severe illness. Please get vaccinated if you aren’t already.

That should have been the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention’s straightforward message to Americans this week, along with a candid analysis of its evidence.

Instead, the CDC on Tuesday issued murky new guidance, without backup evidence, recommending that vaccinated people resume wearing masks indoors in some cases because unpublished studies suggest they could transmit the virus. But on Thursday the Washington Post ran an alarmist story on an internal CDC slide presentation with the unpublished evidence, which triggered a media panic that could undermine vaccinations. Only on Friday afternoon did the agency release some of its evidence and offer a calmer explanation.

What a fiasco. The CDC should be a source of fact and reason, not a hair-on-fire spreader of fear. The agency could start by explaining that Covid cases have been increasing across the U.S. and that more vaccinated individuals are testing positive. But most of these “breakthrough” cases are mild or asymptomatic.

Now, let’s go to the slide deck, please. The CDC estimates there are about 35,000 symptomatic infections among 162 million vaccinated Americans a week. As cases have increased nationwide, so have breakthrough infections. This is to be expected. But recent studies show that vaccines are still 88% protective against symptomatic illness and 96% against hospitalization and death.

Next slide. Vaccinated people are making up a larger share of the hospitalized population and deaths than in the winter. That’s because most older people who are at higher risk have been vaccinated, and vaccines aren’t 100% effective. This doesn’t mean that vaccines don’t prevent severe illness, and the vast majority of people who are hospitalized are unvaccinated.

Real-world evidence from hospitals indicates that vaccines are only about 87% preventive against hospitalizations. That’s lower than published studies, but this may be because vaccines are less protective for some groups. For instance, vaccines are only about 59% protective against Covid hospitalization among the immuno-compromised and only 85% against severe illness among nursing home residents.

An important footnote: Vaccines are more protective in nursing homes where a larger share of the population are vaccinated. That’s why it’s so important for nursing-home workers to be vaccinated even if they themselves are at low risk.

Which brings us to the Delta variant. CDC evidence suggests Delta is more than twice as transmissible as the original virus strain, akin to the chickenpox, which is why cases are rising even in places with relatively high vaccination rates. But don’t freak out like the CDC. Vaccines are still very protective.

Evidence indicates the Delta variant replicates much faster and produces higher viral loads in respiratory passages that allow it to spread more. There’s also some evidence that people infected with Delta are contagious for longer. It’s still uncertain whether breakthrough Delta cases can transmit the virus as much as unvaccinated individuals do.

A study of a July outbreak from Provincetown, Mass., found that infected vaccinated and unvaccinated individuals had similar viral loads, indicating that both groups are equally likely to spread the virus. But vaccinated individuals are still less likely to spread the virus because they are less likely to become infected.
***

Now the CDC is recommending masks again based on evidence of the Delta’s increased transmissibility and vaccination rates that are leaving most places short of herd immunity. The risk is that some people may conclude from this new CDC guidance that, since we still need masks, there’s no need to be vaccinated. That is not true. Masks can help modestly limit the spread while we try to increase vaccination rates. The more people who get vaccinated, the less the virus will spread.

But let’s be clear, unlike the CDC: The virus will never be eradicated. It will eventually become endemic, and the public-health goal is to protect people from getting severely ill.

Congress created the CDC precisely to address an event like Covid-19. It has some 10,700 employees. Yet time and again in this pandemic the CDC has been a source of confusion or ineptitude. And Washington wonders why Americans have lost confidence in Covid experts.


This message has been edited 1 time(s).

'I define fear as standing across from Joe Louis and knowing he wants to go home early.' - Max Baer

Replies to: Finally, an adult take on the vaccine issue


Thread Level: 2

Or maybe this?

Author: eftg1 (12936 Posts - Joined: Sep 19, 2012)

Posted at 3:49 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

A virus always mutates and a coronavirus in particular. The vaxx is speeding up the mutations because it is narrowly targeted on a small set of proteins. All the virus does is replicate with small changes in it's protein profile until one manages to evade the artificial antibodies created by the vaxx.

You have to be careful when discussing a virus because it's not alive. They don't have a thought process to spur itself to survive against a challenge, whether natural immune response or artificial antibodies. As a virus copies itself in cells, some of the copies are "flawed." Most of the time, the flawed copies are destroyed by the immune system because it sees them as foreign material. The vaxx has limited the range of imperfect copies that are recognized as needing destruction. The copies that aren't destroyed become new dominant strains.

I think the "scary" variants are emerging from places where the vaxx phase 2 trials were conducted. The vaxx phase 3 trial, for which millions have become volunteer guinea pigs, will produce even more variants that can evade the vaxx. Those variants should be less deadly, but don't count on government to act accordingly.


Thread Level: 2

I'm guessing that no one on the WSJ Editorial Board watched thIs FOXNews segment

Author: TyroneIrish (20449 Posts - Joined: Oct 8, 2020)

Posted at 1:19 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

before penning their opinion...Dr. Walensky (CDC Director) couldn't have been clearer wrt the Delta variant...and to my eyes, she covered all their "points". Perhaps they were trying to communicate something else to their readers.

https://youtu.be/IPlhcA6t0x0

Thread Level: 3

Ty this

Author: eftg1 (12936 Posts - Joined: Sep 19, 2012)

Posted at 3:17 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

The rise of corporate censors has combined with a heavily pro-Biden media to create the fear of a de facto state media that controls information due to a shared ideology rather than state coercion. "

In other words, The Ministry of Truth is first being formed along ideological lines, to be followed by state sanction and coercion


Thread Level: 2

Re: Finally, an adult take on the vaccine issue

Author: jimbasil (52634 Posts - Joined: Nov 15, 2007)

Posted at 1:03 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

(no message)

Link: https://forum.uhnd.com/forum/index.php?action=display&forumid=2&msgid=23282

Jack, he is a banker
and Jane, she is a clerk
Thread Level: 2

Nobody that needs convincing trusts Fauci at all. Replacing him is the obvious first step.

Author: BaronVonZemo (59941 Posts - Joined: Nov 19, 2010)

Posted at 12:20 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

(no message)

Thread Level: 3

With who...You!?...

Author: TyroneIrish (20449 Posts - Joined: Oct 8, 2020)

Posted at 1:22 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

(no message)

Thread Level: 2

No matter what message the CDC puts out, right wing extremes will butcher it.

Author: Quest4twelve (6684 Posts - Joined: Aug 5, 2015)

Posted at 11:53 am on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

it's pretty much their purpose in life is to discredit the other side. That's why 20-30% Rs say they won't get vaccinated versus 5% Ds.

Thread Level: 3

You’re calling the brothers right wing extremes?

Author: notredame678 (3732 Posts - Joined: Aug 22, 2007)

Posted at 12:35 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

(no message)

Jersey Sucks!
Thread Level: 2

Thanks. Better than conor's link-only post. My take on the jab: it's not immunity, it's suppression

Author: Eli (9555 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 11:36 am on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

of symptoms.

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 3

It’s both. It does decrease your risk of contraction significantly. The insurance is that it also

Author: Frank L (64683 Posts - Joined: Sep 20, 2007)

Posted at 12:16 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

means if it does breakthrough you won’t get seriously ill.

Thread Level: 4

LOL. both = neither. If you're sick, you're not immune. If you're immune, you wont be sick.

Author: Eli (9555 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 12:48 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

39% efficacy (Pfizer) in Israel means this vaccine won't provide immunity to majority population.

Thread Level: 5

Sigh. It means that you won’t get it (immune) or if you do you won’t get very sick

Author: Frank L (64683 Posts - Joined: Sep 20, 2007)

Posted at 1:00 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

(symptoms). Think about it.

Thread Level: 6

I'll get it (immune).Already said in earlier post I prefer physiologic immunity over immunity from

Author: Eli (9555 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 1:13 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

vaccination. But I don't exclude vaccine.

Delta variant still remain a candidate to monitor to get natural immunity/


Thread Level: 7

You should wait until your whole family gets the virus you gave them, and then get vaccinated.

Author: jimbasil (52634 Posts - Joined: Nov 15, 2007)

Posted at 2:45 pm on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

That'll show us all you were right in your hesitancy.

Jack, he is a banker
and Jane, she is a clerk
Thread Level: 2

The CDC like any other government agency has just become a jobs program

Author: holybull101 (10567 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 10:05 am on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

(no message)

Thread Level: 2

Get ready for plaque rat and fucktard tossed yr way

Author: ColeyO (12511 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 10:04 am on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

(no message)

Thread Level: 2

It's all those minority anti-vax Republicans who are triggering the surge in COVID infections.

Author: Curly1918 (16450 Posts - Joined: Aug 30, 2017)

Posted at 9:34 am on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

Just like they are responsible for the current pandemic of inner city gun violence.

We need to do what the Aussies are doing and send the military into these noncompliance zones.

Maybe Joe should put Kamala in the lead on this?


Link: https://www.newyorker.com/news/letter-from-bidens-washington/suddenly-some-republicans-are-all-in-on-the-vaccine?utm_brand=tny&utm_social-type=owned&utm_source=twitter&mbid=social_twitter&utm_medium=social

Thread Level: 3

The Aussies approach.,, could it happen here?

Author: Curly1918 (16450 Posts - Joined: Aug 30, 2017)

Posted at 10:17 am on Jul 31, 2021
View Single

(no message)

Link: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9846939/Soldiers-sent-enforce-lockdown-Sydney.html

Close
  • Facebook
  • Twitter
  • YouTube
  • RSS