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As for your vaunted ID doctor, what about other ID doctors who agree with Baron's views? And I guarantee your ID doctor knows nothing about all the research Dr. Risch did on HCQ+.

was necessary.

can 'embarrass' a non-MD. I'm not afraid to stand up and be held accountable...why aren't you?...should be a piece of cake...right?

Oh, and you'll never be able to provide a post from me that justifies your reasoning for going on "Ignore"...so drop the facade.

where Baron claimed the authors called Masking for COVID-19 ineffective...yet I was able to copy and paste excerpts from that study saying exactly the opposite. In fact it showed benefits for all different types of masks...High Quality KN/95s...Surgical...and even Cloth Masks...plus a 'schema' for calculating the allowable time someone could remain in a school classroom depending on Mask choice and other conditions. Then there was the "NEJM" study of Boston School Districts, which you should know quite well...Baron said it wasn't even a study and had no data...again he was totally wrong...as you know.

For whatever reason, when it comes to all things COVID-19, he comes up on the short end of any related topic...so much so, that others without an MD embarrass him. Perhaps that's why he claims to ignore me...so he won't risk further embarrassment.

As for our family ID and Pulmonary/Critical Care Docs...I've already provided Baron enough information about them, that he knows full well how outstanding they are. He likes to deny they exist, but they are as real as he is. Again, I sense that he's afraid to lose future conversations, should relevant medical knowledge be needed...since I can query them and relay their knowledge. My only problem with that is, I have to be sure not to mention his name...they've seen other Docs like him and have had enough...not every Doc is a great one.

btw, as regards Baron's disconnect from good medical practice when it comes to fighting an Infectious Disease like COVID-19...here is a statement from the Infectious Disease Society of America, regarding the value of Masking. clearly a whole lot of ID Docs (i.e. Thousands) disagree with Baron.

https://www.idsociety.org/news--publications-new/articles/2022/idsa-response-to-cdcs-updates-on-masking-guidance/

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whether you are incapable of processing information...or willingly ignorant.

Beaches and Schools were closed because we had just been hit with an airborne virus, SARS-CoV-2, that didn't act like its progenitor...SARS-CoV...especially when it come to transmission...i.e. Infected persons (~40%) could be Asymptomatic (not the case with SARS-CoV). This necessitated the basic protocols of Infectious Disease Control and Epidemiology...which are 1) Social Distancing, and 2) Mask Wearing. Since schools obviously crowd kids and teachers together in often poorly ventilated rooms, it was necessary to close them down until we had vaccines and improved facilities...once that happened, schools opened, depending on whether a District had complied.

As for Beach Closings, you conveniently forget the 2020 Spring Breaks in FLA and elsewhere during the early surge of COVID-19 when partiers were literally jammed together on those beaches...with "Social Distancing" measured in inches, if not millimeters ;-)...GREAT if you're a SARS-CoV-2 virus...NOT SO GREAT if you are a human being who could either get sick...OR...get infected and SPREAD the disease to others who might be exceedingly VULNERABLE....with NO VACCINES, or verified treatments.

Let's also remember that Hospitals were being OVERRUN with COVID-19 patients that needed to be isolated from everyone else due to the high chance of transmission...i.e. it affected ALL the others being treated for cancer, etc, etc. Note that some Hospitals had to use refrigerated Semi-Trucks as makeshift Morgues in the parking lot, it was so bad..

You've now been informed and educated...please internalize it...learn from it...and don't repeat such misleading and non-productive remarks.

Btw, one of our extended family Docs is a Pulmonary/Critical Care Specialist...and also knows that "In Emergencies" (Like COVID-19) you need to take EXTRAORDINARY MEASURES in order to SAVE LIVES. One other thing...one need not go to a crowned beach during an airborne virus pandemic in order to reap the benefits of Vitamin D from sunlight...just thought you should know.

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Everyone else - even the libs - have abandoned these moronic stances he's clinging to.

should have be closed is truly "Monday Morning Quarterbacking" and definitely debatable. Here's a Google AI Summary of the issue.

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AI Overview

In the early days of the COVID-19 pandemic, the decision to close schools was a complex one, involving significant debate and a lack of complete information about the virus and its effects.

Arguments in favor of initial school closures included:

Uncertainty about transmission: There was a lack of clear understanding about how easily the virus spread among children and the severity of illness in children.

Protecting vulnerable populations: School closures were seen as a way to reduce community transmission and protect at-risk adults and children.

Precautionary measure: School closures have historically been used in short bursts during pandemics, like influenza, to curb transmission.

Arguments against school closures and the observed consequences:

Incomplete evidence of effectiveness: Some studies suggest school closures alone were not a significant factor in curbing the virus, especially in comparison to other measures like masking and vaccination.

Educational and developmental disruption: Prolonged school closures led to significant learning loss, particularly for low-income and minority students, exacerbating existing educational inequalities.

Impact on mental health and well-being: Isolation and disruption to routine negatively impacted children's mental and physical health.
Current research and perspectives:

Initial closures may have been justifiable due to uncertainty: Given the initial unknowns, some temporary closures at the pandemic's outset may have been understandable.

Reopening schools safely should have been prioritized: As data emerged, revealing the effectiveness of mitigation strategies like masking, a quicker return to in-person learning with safety protocols should have been a greater priority.

The impact on students was significant and long-lasting: Studies continue to highlight the negative and potentially long-term academic, social, and emotional consequences for students, especially those from disadvantaged backgrounds.

Ultimately, whether the initial decision to close schools was "right" is complex and involves considering the unknown factors at the time against the eventual consequences that became clearer over time. The lessons learned highlight the importance of balancing public health concerns with the critical educational and developmental needs of children in future pandemic responses.
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Beach activity in Florida was never tied to a "surge" in COVID. What a ridiculous claim.

And we've already laughed at your dug-in position that schools needed to remain closed until a vaccine was available. What a stupid, comical take that isn't supported by anyone anymore.

spread amongst the population more easily....as noted in the linked article.

Once again, for the slow learners...it's a fundamental epidemiology to have persons not get close to one another during an airborne virus pandemic...if the virus can't reach other hosts...it dies. Is that beyond your ability to comprehend?


Link: https://thehill.com/opinion/education/5407059-teachers-unions-covid-19-school-closures/

By your asinine, insufferable "logic," schools should have been closed until December 2020. Only liars and morons think this way.

Similarly, given that schools largely were open before that, was 90% of the U.S. - even in liberal ones - lacking your wisdom?

(Your handlers are failing you today...)

of closures is worthy of debate...but definitely influenced by the ability of School Districts to put mitigating measures in place...and have vaccines available for teachers and staff.

Clearly, there are MANY others who agree with my assessment...your 'personalization' of the issue makes no sense...but I suspect you know that ;-)

No one that I'm aware of disputed the "initial closures." But you've clung to the notion on this very board that schools should have been closed until vaccines were available, and now you realize that it isn't a defensible position. You're trying to spin out, because you can't remember what you're supposed to defend.

consistent in support of vaccines being available as a prerequisite for opening schools...for the protection of Teachers...Staff...and Vulnerable Family Members of School Children...born out by actual studies as summarized below. Come better prepared next time...i.e do at least some 'Critical Thinking' before posting.
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AI Overview

While vaccines played a role in the decision-making surrounding school reopenings during the COVID-19 pandemic, their impact was complex and varied across different contexts. Here's a breakdown:

Enabling Safer Environments: Widespread vaccination, particularly among teachers and staff, was a crucial factor in creating safer environments for in-person learning. Washington state, for example, required all K-12 school employees to be vaccinated or obtain an exemption, and this measure, combined with other safety protocols, contributed to making schools safer places for children to be.

Reduced Transmission: Studies, like one conducted in Sicily, suggested that school-age vaccination played a significant role in reducing the spread of COVID-19 cases after schools reopened, according to Wiley Online Library.

Policy Decisions: The availability and rollout of vaccines influenced policy decisions regarding school opening models and mitigation measures. Some regions, particularly in more liberal areas, implemented vaccine mandates for students in extracurricular activities or for adult visitors, while other states enacted bans on requiring COVID-19 vaccination as a condition of in-person learning.

Layered Approach: Recommendations from organizations like the American Academy of Pediatrics emphasized a layered approach to making schools safe, combining vaccinations with other measures like masking, ventilation, and testing, according to HealthyChildren.org.

Varying Approaches and Outcomes: The impact of vaccine availability and mandates on school reopenings and the spread of the virus varied by region and specific policies implemented. Studies showed conflicting results, with some suggesting a substantial impact on transmission in certain contexts, while others found minimal or no evidence of increased transmission when in-person learning resumed with appropriate mitigation measures.

In essence, vaccines contributed to making school environments safer and supported the return to in-person learning, but it was often part of a broader strategy that also included other public health measures and depended on local context and policy decisions.
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A stupid, moronic idea. Even the liberal cities didn't pull that shit. Check with your handlers again.

especially Teachers and Staff. BTW, ever catch a cold from your kids? ;-)

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I have...

Were schools closed until a vaccine was available? No. So everyone clearly thinks your take is idiotic, impractical, and having no basis in sanity.

AI Overview

While vaccines played a role in the decision-making surrounding school reopenings during the COVID-19 pandemic, their impact was complex and varied across different contexts. Here's a breakdown:

Enabling Safer Environments: Widespread vaccination, particularly among teachers and staff, was a crucial factor in creating safer environments for in-person learning. Washington state, for example, required all K-12 school employees to be vaccinated or obtain an exemption, and this measure, combined with other safety protocols, contributed to making schools safer places for children to be.

Reduced Transmission: Studies, like one conducted in Sicily, suggested that school-age vaccination played a significant role in reducing the spread of COVID-19 cases after schools reopened, according to Wiley Online Library.

Policy Decisions: The availability and rollout of vaccines influenced policy decisions regarding school opening models and mitigation measures. Some regions, particularly in more liberal areas, implemented vaccine mandates for students in extracurricular activities or for adult visitors, while other states enacted bans on requiring COVID-19 vaccination as a condition of in-person learning.

Layered Approach: Recommendations from organizations like the American Academy of Pediatrics emphasized a layered approach to making schools safe, combining vaccinations with other measures like masking, ventilation, and testing, according to HealthyChildren.org.

Varying Approaches and Outcomes: The impact of vaccine availability and mandates on school reopenings and the spread of the virus varied by region and specific policies implemented. Studies showed conflicting results, with some suggesting a substantial impact on transmission in certain contexts, while others found minimal or no evidence of increased transmission when in-person learning resumed with appropriate mitigation measures.

In essence, vaccines contributed to making school environments safer and supported the return to in-person learning, but it was often part of a broader strategy that also included other public health measures and depended on local context and policy decisions.
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There are Critical Thinking Adults on this Forum...there's still time for you to join in, Jake.

You claimed that schools should have stayed closed until a vaccine was available. Now you're back to "a layered approach."

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that?…hmm…

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That virus was totally new, did not act like other corona viruses, and too often authorities erred on the side of caution. Closing beaches was idiocy.

And yes, of course lessons have been learned.

And the same idiots would do it again.

This was not novel as the Left makes excuses after the fact for what we told you.
Outdoors shut down …now THAT was novel.

Stay in your lane, yoy have enough trouble there. We told you at the time and you fucking scoffed.

You are an autodidact

Epidemiology. He should heed his own advice and stay in his OB/GYN lane. I'll repeat that I gave our extended family Infectious Disease and Pulmonary/Critical Care Physicians a sampling of Baron's posts...they made it clear that they've encountered such Docs before...and then made it equally clear they didn't want to waste their time on him again.

Or just because they love to control beaches?

Or they hate tans?

reason. There was no medical precedent for what you did, yet Fauci et all claimed that they had studies to support their restrictions of freedoms - particularly that the vaccine supposedly prevented spread of COVID which he used to force people to get a vaccine that they didn't trust.
Because of this, we can't convince people to get vaccines in general. The damage to public trust may well have been permanent.
I was on this board telling you all what was going on and giving you research articles, etc., but you all chose The CNN School of Medicine instead. We also had politically motivated posters posting false data, selective data, misrepresented data and incorrect interpretations.

I's also like to further discuss your claim that this was on Trump when he was in office.
The initial power was entirely in the hands of the governors....who followed Fauci....who followed Dem leaders, not Trump. His about face on masks from his interview on 60 minutes where he told the real truth to the stance he adopted after meeting with Dem leaders was shocking (I've linked this interview many times).
Shifts on such basic and well known epidemiological medical science simply do not happen like that overnight....esp without any groundbreaking studies.
The fault of this COVID debacle fell squarely on the Left and was proven when they would not let us out of Lockdown for far too long....and then only because of Rick DeSantis and Florida leading the way.

You cannot act like we "didn't know" what to do with this novel situation. We have handled pandemics well before this. The reason we got into such trouble is because WE DIDN'T follow our well established protocols.
Now, you can put back on on your homemade, reused mask if you like, but there was never EVER and justification for it....and I told you back then.

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But isn’t “herd immunity” done once the researchers know enough enough about the disease that there is a low chance of fatalities? COVID came on fast and it killed millions worldwide.

describes how all the vulnerable people would be identified and kept safe from any contact with COVID-19...and for how long the Program would run...plus the Funding Plan to cover it...all in the midst of a raging pandemic that was causing some hospitals to use refrigerated semi-trucks as temporary morgues. This is just Baron's regurgitation of The Great Barrington Declaration...which was quickly rejected by virologists, epidemiologists and Infectious Disease Specialists...for obvious reasons.

As for Dr. Fauci...upon his retirement announcement, over 9,000 attendees at the Infectious Disease Society of America (IDSA) annual meeting gave him rousing and sustained applause for his work. As someone who has been discussing COVID-19 issues with ID and Critical Care (ICU) Physicians all through the pandemic, I can safely say that such specialists do not 'Suffer Fools Gladly"...thus, that adulation was for Professionalism at the highest level...recognition that Baron is unlikely to receive.

school closures.

We have managed other devastating viral epidemics successfully using what I said above (isolate the high risk patients only and let herd immunity develop in the low risk). H1N1 is a good example.

The initial Shut Down for COVID was for a plausible reason (to "blunt the curve" to prevent flooding of hospitals - esp when there weren't enough ventilators early on. BUT after a short time, that reason was past....yet Fauci et al wouldn't give the ok to start our lives back up after this goal was achieved.
The low risk people should have been allowed to resume their lives (especially schools) while high risk people were isolated. In fact, even when there was a vaccine which clearly lowered the danger of death to high risk patients and medical management got better, Fauci et al would not stop the Shut Down.
It took DeSantis in Florida bucking the Fauci crap without suffering the supposed consequences for the country to finally say, "enough!".

Because we did not follow our usual protocols, our country suffered not just the damage from the epidemic, but even more long term damage from the Shut Down itself. Sweden avoided much of the Shut Down damage by following real scientific studies free of political influence.

And now we have a large group of people distrusting of our medical system because it was clearly politicized. What can you say to convince these people to get a good vaccine (for example measles)...it's a long, uphill talk, and it frequently goes nowhere.
They were lied to, and they know it. And we all know it too.
I will say it again:
Anthony Fauci harmed more people than any doctor in the history of the world, and it is not even close. His Autopen pardon was despicable.

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