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Link: http://thespun.com/news/mel-kiper-mock-draft-2017/10#paginated
he has a hard-on about Kizer. Useless garbage.
So maybe he knows that Kizer is a long term project.
extensive----plus he may have regressed a bit since beating VA.
He certainly improved throughout 2015, right up to Stanford where he had a good game. Then a bad game against tOSU, But his zenith, imo, was against Texas 2016. He played great up till the last drive of regulation. He may have been better off to fake an injury after that game and declare for the draft, (tongue in cheek). It was down hill from there.
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Stay classy oldirish, stay classy.
I'm sorry you don't understand this definition.
It's a false assumption by you to think I am taking a shot at a kid when all I am doing is making an estimation, based on my opinion, of his play as to how he will project out in the pros.
These are the facts I gathered from watching him: Kizer has a losing record, he doesn't elevate the play of those around him, he's borderline overweight for a QB, he tends to hold the ball way to long, he's indecisive, he's proven to lack the ability to scan the field and find the open WR, he never looks middle, he locks onto WRs, he audibles to frequently into the wrong play, he plays the first quarter and last 3 minutes of the game but fails to stay awake for the entire middle of the game, He shows pretty good to very good pocket awareness, He throws a nice deep ball but is fairly inaccurate, he presses a lot and his play declines quickly, He's a timid and frail runner but faster than he looks, Mentally he seems to struggle when the going gets tough, He doesn't play with fire or passion, Too many deer in headlight looks for the amount of games he's played.
None of this translates into a high or first round draft choice. On paper he looks good. In games he does not. He's a high risk project.
On the bright side he seems to have his head on his shoulders. Maybe he turns into a football junkie and proves me wrong. I see 10 QBs a year come out of college who have more skill and look better than Kizer does today. Most of those guys never make it. Kizer is like a poor mans version of Dante Culpepper. A very poor man.
Look 3 years back since those guys have at least been in the league long enough to get an idea, 2014 draft:
1. Bortles (1) - Kizer's not even close and Bortles is about to get the axe because he's been subpar
2. Manziel (1) - Way more talent than Kizer, but a total bonehead. Out of football
3. Bridgewater (1) - Slow to progress but making his way before injury. Kizer has more raw size and arm but TB is a much better leader.
4. Derek Carr (2) - Killing it. More fire, passion and better passer
5. Jimmy Garoppolo (2) - Probably career backup. I don't know much about him. NE likes him.
6. Logan Thomas (4) - YOUR BEST COMPARISON. Labeled a project. Very similar to Kizer in size, skill and college performance. Nothing to date
7. Tom Savage (4) - Back up until Osweiler became inept. Then went to backup again. Underperformed in college, maybe similar to Kizer
8. Aaron Murray (5) - Light years ahead of Kizer in college play and skill (minus arm). I think he might be out of football already
9. AJ McCarron (5) - Spot duty. Much less skill, much better understanding of the game mentally. Better pure QB
10.Zach Mettenberger (6) - Career backup with big arm. Might be out of football this year.
Out of this list I might take Kizer over Garoppolo and Mettenberger, but I never saw Garoppolo play in college. Everyone was far superior to Kizer in college. Looking at this list I would put Kizer being drafted in rounds 4-6 rounds with the outside chance of 7 to undrafted. I think he's a big enough project, so I really doubt he'd go undrafted. I wouldn't be surprised but highly doubt it.
You are taking a shot based on ZERO evidence. If anything, he played his best when the team was down. He lacked consistency...not toughness.
If you want to say that he is a high risk/ high reward prospect, I agree with that. I still think he was the best college QB ND has had since Clausen.
Also, I'll wager a lifetime ban from this board that he's drafted higher than Round 4.
If you are such an expert....put your money where your mouth is.
He starts fast and then checks out. Usually he'd get two back to back stalled drives, and start his wincing faces and sort of slumpish body language.
Maybe it was Kelly, I don't know, but DK sure didn't seem to have a very good grasp of what they were trying to do. If you watched the facial expressions, body language and hand gestures during games, they weren't fully of confidence.
How many winning drives did DK have in 2016? How many opportunities did he have?
If you think Clausen is our best QB in some time, that tells me enough. You side with the "potential" guys over the guys that get wins. You favor two guys (Clausen and DK) that own two of the worst single season records in ND's 120+ year history. That's all I need to know.
I don't have to wager a ban. I've almost banned myself numerous times for the amount of dumb post I see. It's tough looking at all the gogo post about underperforming 5* and "body type" / paper projection guys (Jarrett Grace). I prefer production. Furthermore, that would be the dumbest bet ever. HELLO.... the NFL loves combine rats, body type or paper projection guys. That is EXACTLY what Kizer is.
How many first rounders have successful NFL careers? Statistically, not as many as late round guys. Why? Because they are guys that do well in drills and on paper but go blank when the lights come on.
Do I think the NFL will grade Kizer high? Sure. Do I think they will draft him before the 4th round? Definitely. Hell, Blaine Gabbert was drafted in the top 2 or 3 QBs his draft year. He was a far superior college QB to Kizer but not a fit for the pro's at all. And he went mid first round in a bad QB class (much like Kizer). So there is no way I would make that bet. It's like wanting to bet the weatherman's gonna be right.
Who is better thank Kizer since Clausen. The options are Crist, Rees, Hendrix, Golson, and Zaire...I don't think its a stretch to say the DK was the best of that bunch (none of the others were drafted, and like Clausen DK will likely be no later than 2nd round)
Quinn was better than either Kizer or Clausen....and he was the best ND QB since Mirer.
As far as how Kizer played in clutch situations...See VA, Temple and Stanford in 2015.
In 2016: Texas -had what should have been game-winning drive late in 4th before defense blew it; also had TD scoring drive in first overtime; MSU - led 3 straight scoring drives, including 2 in 4th quarter to get ND back in game after big deficit; Duke-as with Texas led what should have been game-winning scoring drive late in 4th only to have defense blow it again; Miami led game-winning scoring drive
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for himself. Great marketing and ESPN love for him helps.
any two minute drives that could have won us 6 more games this year. Also showing an inconsistent accuracy and poor decision making. Coaching cannot be blamed for this but a years more experience might have helped him. Alas he saw the poor competition at QB and decided the money was more important. He may be decent two years down the road and he may be great 4 years down the road. He is not that good yet though.
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himself with great marketing over the years.
He will never be a starting QB.....look for similar beahvior to Clausen and Quinn....a couple other "can't miss" ND QBs
Quinn was light years better than Kizer. Clausen was a lot better, but his record and leadership capabilities were just as poor.
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Quinn and Clausen, despite their pro failures, were better college QB's by a mile than Kizer was last year. A team drafting him would be drafting on pure raw projection. I would compare him to EJ Manuel.
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board members act like they can project the next great one ...
He will be out of the league by next year. Most even at the time considered it a stupid pick by the Bills (I realize that sentence is kind of redundant).
But it serves him to be "under drafted" than over drafted.
Hype and high expectations has ruined many players, especially at qb.
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If Mel is right, Kizer might have made a mistake going early. I agree with him on slotting Kizer 3rd, but QB is such a position of need that I can't see the 3rd QB waiting until the 2nd round.
I would also like to point out how stupid it is to project these things before the Combine.
QBS simply go earlier than their rating.
but if not, he won't last past Cleveland or San Francisco in the first two picks in Round 2
I'm pretty sure that Kizer is going to have an excellent showing in Indianapolis when the NFL combine roll around, and another one when ND's Pro Day comes about.
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Certainly would improve his completion %.
So many short passes with receivers wide open once the read is made.
I agree Kizer should have had a higher completion percentage.
But, Long's offense involves a lot more RB and WR screens than Kelly's. It is a fact.
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