That is part of critical debate. Most people don't run into a room make a statement and run out of the room. Your posts would be taken more seriously if you could actually back up your claims. Just saying for future reference if you care.
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Do your remember when Rocket ran two Kick Off returns back for TD's in the same game against Michigan?
Do you remember when Tom Zbikowski ran a punt back for a TD against USC turning the game around?
So you remember when Reggie Ho hit a game winning field goal to beat Michigan?
And unfortunately do you remember in '93 when BC hit a last second field goal which cost ND the National Championship?
All I can remember off the top of my head you dumb ass. Still think special teams are not that important. Shut the fuck up.
The things you point out are anecdotal, I pointed out factual evidence that you've yet to refute in any way.
1. FG kicking is separate from your "ignore special teams" thesis. The FG kickers kick all practice long. And FG kicking under Kelly has been excellent. But you know when FG kicking doesn't matter? When you ignore the 2 minute drill in favor of extra time spent on kickoff and punt coverage teams.
2. Rocket and Zibby were special talents, they were both great returners before they came to ND. We don't have one of those on our team currently, but if we did you'd attribute their success to "not ignoring special teams"? I disagree. Teams that have great return units have great returners, which are born, not created through practice.
3. There is a limited amount of time available to practice. The coaches haven't ignored special teams, they just haven't over emphasized it's importance as you would.
4. One of the greatest special teams coaches of all time was Frank Beamer, how many national titles did he win?
S&P+ only started rating ST in 2014, here are the last 4 National Champions and where their ST ranked that year.
2017 Alabama 52
2016 Clemson 85
2015 Alabama 61
2014 OSU 54
Please explain why these teams have been successful despite "ignoring" special teams.
Your whole argument is based on false equivalence. The title winners you state in your FACTS didn't need great special teams because their players where so dominate in every other aspect of the game. Saying ND can do the same shows your convoluted logic. ND is no where as good as Bama or Clemson. Consider an alternative, one advantage might be better special teams. A KO return, a punt return might beat them, or a blocked punt returned for a TD. What you call a waste of time may be seen as an advantage for a great, daring coach that realizes he is over-matched and looks for ways to even the playing field. But your too stupid to understand that. Kelly can spend the whole practice sessions until the playoffs begin on line blocking and they still won't gain more than 50 yards on Bama or Clemson. If he spent anytime on special teams blocking it could lead to a score or at the least fewer mistakes and better field position.
You can't be this stupid. And shove your facts up your ass. Rocket and Tommy would never had scored without blocking which takes practice. I'm sure Rocket was viewed as "anecdotal" by Holtz, every time he returned a kick he was a threat to score with great special teams play, all 11 guys.
And which other area are you going to take this time from? The point you are missing is that you must rob peter to pay paul, there is a finite amount of practice time to spend. If we score a TD on a return and give up two because we didn't properly prepare, what have we gained?
You are correct that the 4 teams that I cited have excellent talent, so why do you suppose their special teams are mediocre? Are Saban, Swinney and Meyer just terrible coaches, like Brian Kelly? Or have they decided the time is better spent somewhere else?
Also, since you're a fan of anecdotes, do you remember the 2007 BCS National Championship game? OSU returned the opening kickoff for a TD but ended up losing 41-14. Do you suppose Urban Meyer regretted not spending more time on kickoff coverage in practice?
OMG you are overwrought, there is just no time. Oh Auntie EM!!
Wonder how other teams manage.
So if our special teams suck because there is just no time, than why does O Line blocking suck? Or maybe it could be worse, is that your thought? Maybe those are the same guys that let a punt get blocked?
You never took Forensic classes did you? You argue in circles.
I never said Bama and Clemson have bad coaching but you conveniently ignore my main thesis. Both coaches know where their advantage is against other teams. They don't need special teams play, isn't that obvious to you? Is ND in that position? Does Kelly know this? Or will he walk into another debacle like 2012?
How about the performance last week? Was that shit fest on ST, ND can expect on a regular basis? You know that answer, don't you? You are trying to make an idiotic argument that ND can't focus more time on special teams and it doesn't matter because much better teams have won a NC without good special teams. Do you understand how stupid that sounds? Whether they have time to practice or not sooner or later it will bite them in the ass.
It's your assertion that we scored TDs with Rocket and Zibby because we put more of an emphasis on ST. No, we scored TDs with Rocket and Zibby because they were phenomenal returners. We don't have a Rocket or a Tommy, so spending more time on special teams isn't going to produce Rocket or Tommy results. Capice?
The top 10 teams in ST efficiency according to S&P+ are a combined 47-32. They haven't beaten the Alabamas and Clemsons either.
But you're almost starting to get it. If we have extra time, I would spend it on OL blocking. Better OL blocking will have more of an effect on the outcome of our games than ST, especially against Alabama and Clemson.
When Kelly gets fired for ignoring special teams on his way to 12-0, I hope you get your shot Frank (Beamer).
Otherwise this will never end, let's just agree that I'm more right than you. Look out if a ST play causes a loss, but I promise not to say a word.
Comprende?
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Just stop, didn't realize you were Hispanic, that makes sense.
interceptions.
The disagreement is in whether those bad plays are a result of "ignoring" special teams and also how much emphasis should be placed on ST at the detriment of other areas. I do believe that Holtz's teams had the occasional blocked punt, missed FG or kick out of bounds. If you dedicate more practice time to ST, it won't necessarily eliminate bad plays, especially the missed FG.
I have enjoyed the debate and I hope you have as well. Slainte.
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my share of abuse from my posts but always respond. This drive by crap from DonMiller everyday without a response to support his drivel is getting old. But then again maybe it's our moderators just stirring the pot. No that wouldn't happen.
Just ignore him
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