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As far as coaching goes, I think BK is above average coach at a school where the ongoing expectation is for an elite coach.

How BK manages the Covid-19 and social protest that is engulfing the sports world, will be the ultimate test of his capabilities and skills.

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Comprehend what you read.

Ghost, you pointed out what many on here point out. That is the fact that Kelly is better than the previous three coaches. That is finding some kind of comfort or consolation in a less than desirable situation. The very definition of solace.

I doubt there is anyone on this board that thinks Kelly isn't better than those three. So what? Shouldn't the ND fans desire a much better situation than to just be better than them? I think you probably agree with that. Now, whether ND can ever get there is another debate.

No urban meyer crap. Give us the name that will raise the bar and NC trophy. Kelly has
gotten ND to the NC game (lost) and to the playoffs (lost). So that is where his bar sits. Save some
of us from going into solace mode again. No if, and or but about it. Unveil the prophet that will lead
us to the promised land.

You want a guarantee of success, or else, you'll accept just mediocre to sometimes good.

There are many possibilities. I don't pretend to know who that person is that would bring guarantied success. But that doesn't mean I don't think there is someone that could lead ND to a championship. The great coaches at ND have not come from obvious situations. One thing they all have in common though, is none of them needed 11 years to get ND over the hump.

Jack Swarbrick should have a list of candidates that he keeps if he needs them. That's what a competent AD would do, and I think Swarbrick is at least that. Hiring another head coach from anywhere would not "guarantee" anything. But we know the one we have has not gotten ND where most want her to be, even if he's better than the one's immediately before him. If whomever is hired does not do the job after 5 years, hire another. You keep hiring until you find the one who does do it. The ND I loved did not accept the low bar that has been set.

I trust that you want ND to win as I do. Maybe, you feel that it can't be done. Like I wrote, that's another argument and debatable.

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A natty within 5 years is not a set in stone criteria. But a consistent progression toward that goal is. Again, every great coach at ND has won a title within 3 years. Yet, we know the landscape is different now.

In Kelly's first five years we saw mediocrity with one magical year. The next five were pretty much more of the same. An easier schedule has produced the illusion that more wins must mean the program is in great shape. Look beyond the wins and losses. When ND has been in position to play for a title, they have been thoroughly embarrassed. Kelly has shown a real lack of ability to consistently get the team ready to play in a big game. His in-game adjustments have been poor. His demeanor has at times been an embarrassment to the school and it's alumni. The program has seemed to take a step forward and then a step backward throughout his time here.

The off the field issues alone would have been enough to get him shown the door under Fr Hesburgh or Fr Cavanaugh.

When Kelly was hired he looked to be a great fit. The one thing that was worrisome was that his success was on a very small stage. That has indeed played out that he was small- timey. His recruiting strategy has resembled that of a Big East type program.

Ghostwriter, you and I want ND to win. You are absolutely right in that he is better than Davie, Willingham, and Weis. And as long as Kelly is the coach I will root for him to succeed and will root for ND to win every game. But what Brian Kelly has shown to this point is that he can't get ND to the top level. And I prefer to aspire for something better.

that a coach can come here and go 11-2 for 5 straight years run a clean program but NOT make
the playoffs (as it stands now 4-teams) and COULD be shown the door. That would be harsh let
alone the scrutiny ND would receive from the media. ND won't accept many players that end up
in the SEC, clemson or ohio st. and have to fight for the ones they can. I'm not saying you have
to settle on a coach but watch what you ask for. It may take a while (years) to find a coach to your
liking and I bet some ND fans still won't be happy. With all that said, I think Kelly will leave in
2 or 3 years at most.

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You wrote consistent progression and getting the job done, blah, blah, blah.
I'm asking you (ND-AD) what W/L numbers, bowl games, playoff games or NC's
would a coach have to achieve in his 5 years to be retained. Just give me an overall
5 year record with post season achievements not rhetoric. I want to know what you
think is acceptable.

I thought this discussion started out well, but now you mock what someone tells you simply because you don't understand it.

You keep asking for absolutes. You wanted a guarantee of success before moving away from a mediocre coach. Now you want me to come up with a magic win number taken in a vacuum. There is no magic number. What if ND had a schedule that included a few vast underdogs, several out manned opponents and a couple "big game" opponents. Say ND wins the games against the out manned and underdogs but loses embarrassingly in the big games. Would that be acceptable?

Contrast that with a schedule that might include 6 or 7 top 25 teams, maybe 3 or 4 top five to ten teams. In that instance, maybe ND wins the games in which they are big favorites and splits the tougher games but is competitive in all of them, where a play here or there determines the result. That would be a better situation, even if the win loss record may be worse. There would be evidence that the team may be on the doorstep of success.

What if a program had several incidents that embarrassed the school and tarnished her image, and even brought NCAA sanctions. Would any win total in that situation be acceptable?

Asking what bowl win, what titles won, what finite win number is acceptable without knowing how the team got there is a futile exercise. Determining whether or not a program is moving in the right direction in a timely manner is really not that difficult to see. I'm sorry if you can't understand that.

You're right.
I glad you're not the AD. You interviewing a perspective head coach would make
his head spin with all your drivel. I can't take reading anymore of your boring torturous whiny crap.
THE END

You didn't disappoint with your well thought out response. Sorry the world isn't black and white enough for you.

I know for a fact from talking to the late Fr Cavanaugh, that "drivel" was pretty much included in the way the job was discussed with Leahy, Parseghian, and Devine. I can't attest to what was discussed with the others, though my guess is that there were similar discussions with every coach ND has had. I doubt there was any mention of how many wins they had to have, nor how many national championships they had to win. Because, that certainly wouldn't turn off any prospective coach.

Every coach was given a five year contract with three directives. Strive for excellence, don't break the rules, and don't embarrass the school. The subsequent contracts were then subject to review after the five years. I'm kind of glad that some were able to think a little deeper than others.

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