There seems to be some confusion. China/Xi bad, US/Trump good. Glad I cleared the air.
So any of you anti Trump posters and believe me he’s far from perfect but compared to China and Xi he’s a walk in the park. So how about some patriotism you assholes?
Replies to: There seems to be some confusion. China/Xi bad, US/Trump good. Glad I cleared the air.
What I find most interesting is the hatred for Trump prevents the condemnation of China. It’s just
wrong. I never voted for Obama but he was the president. But while i might understand your hatred for this president the fact that you would support a communist government over American interest is astonishing.
What I find most interesting is no one here has praised China and you go all nutty.
But you're so far up your own ass you can't think straight.
So, that makes sense.
So I assume you support Trump’s taking on China’s unfair trade policies?
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Get ready for your mind to be blown.
You can dislike China's unfair trade policies, and dislike Trump's method of challenging them.
Both. At. The. Same. Time.
Fine so how do you negotiate with China and change the dynamic unlike Bush and Obama?
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And Reagan who started it all.
You do it by bringing a coalition like TPP and the EU against them on unfair practices.
You don’t do it by embracing a lib dem tariff freak like Navarro.
They severely underestimated China’s will in this.
The same group that turns a blind eye to China’s trade and domestic policies. Sure.
How has that worked out since Bush pushed for them in the WTO. Get serious. The EU is not a player. You know that.
You are completely irrational on this subject.
It’s as much in their interest as ours to put an end to China’s trade practices. The other pacific rim nations that are alternatives to China also have every incentive to knock them down. It takes leadership, will, and patience. It’s the only viable way.
Kind of like no drama Obama while our jobs move overseas. Trump is hurting China. So there is that.
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Obama had steady job growth his entire presidency.
Maybe whatever he was doing made sense.
Stay on China
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You said our jobs moved overseas under Obama.
Do you think it is relevant that millions of jobs were created under Obama, and that unemployment fell to 4.7% under Obama?
Did plants in the Midwest and Southeast close and move overseas? Those people that voted for Trump.
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Unemployment was going down.
...and goods were getting cheaper for the middle class to purchase.
There are two sides to this. I don't really know the right balance of trade policies, but then again I do not have teams of economists working for me like Obama, Bush, Clinton and Reagan did.
Not you, though. You know exactly what to do, and it is exactly what Trump is doing.
There is a difference between making cars or electronics, and serving up big macs.
The latter results in reduced unemployment, but it is not necessarily better for the country or for the employees.
The trade war is about the types of jobs Americans get to have.
Making electronics was moving offshore since the 60’s when the Japs started making transistors.
Are you a market capitalist or not? The market and technology dictate manufacturing.
Inefficiency, obsolescence, and high labor costs drove most manufacturing from here.
You want to artificially bring back that which from a cost perspective makes no sense, so you let the govt. arbitrarily intervene through tariffs.
I'm an American. It is better for the world that America survive.
That which worked for the US 100 years ago now works for China. Maybe it is time to change paradigms. No need to be a slave to a system which no longer works. I'm not an expert on these things. But, I am willing to be flexible, and consider that the old systems are not good for us now.
You are whatever it serves your purpose to be. Change the system huh? Like AOC and others want to
do. They are tariff lovers also.
Meh. They can't be wrong all the time, can they?
Look, I was always a free market guy. Back in those heady days, going to Libertarian Party Conventions, I was drinking the free market coolaid.
I still think that all other things being equal, free markets are better. I'm not AOC communist looking for government control of the economy. That's totally moronic to even go there. It's like you are trying to force me into one of only two extermes.
We are talking about tariffs here. A trade war. The US used to be in the position of China...a developing nation about to break out and take over the world economically speaking. Free trade was great for us then. No so much for England. Now, we are the old England, and China is the old US, economically speaking. Doesn't it make sense to you that free trade is great for China when they have cheap labor like they do?...especially when they are stealing our technology? Yes, I get the arguments that free markets are better in the long run. But, don't worry, the GOP and the Dems are spending us into oblivion, so how long can the long run really be???. We might as well keep jobs here as long as we can. And, I've already seen that the tariffs work in real life. You can make this personal if you want, but it isn't for me. I'm not thinking politically. I'm trying to make the best call for the country at the moment. Don't let it hurt your feelings. I mean, I don't get why it would, but you are taking this a little too personally, and trying to insult me back into my old free market ways. Maybe I will dice this brief flirtation with tariffs was a mistake. But, for now, it doesn't seem like such a bad idea.
I’m simply pointing out the lack of consistency in your positions.
While you always raise this, it’s not personal.
You seem like a good guy and generally make reasonable points. I just disagree with some and point out the inconsistencies. Tariffs is a big one.
They did that starting with Reagan. Remember the Springsteen song from 84.
Non competitive, high wage, labor intensive manufacturing always goes away through market forces and innovation.
Fine so let’s go back to him. Who spoke to those forgotten Americans that both parties ignored?
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Because he was able to play on their resentment, that makes his policies sound ones?
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Did it work? Did Bush or Obama solve their problems? Tell the truth. What makes Trump different
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Unemployment went from 4.7% to 3.7%, so...
Either Trump's trade war worked for 1% of the work force, or unemployment would have happened anyway, without the Trade War.
Riddle me this caped crusader, what was unemployment when Barry took over? Who reduced it more?
And who left it to Barry that way? Oh yeah Chad’s pals W and Vice.
It was around 10%. Damn. I guess his China policy wasn't so bad.
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He’s nuts and a demagogue and they weren’t?
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And Obama wasn’t?
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No he wasn’t, although he was many other not so good things.
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I’m sorry wasn’t he going to cure the planet, make the seas fall and give everyone better healthcare
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Yup, and he even had Greek columns for his acceptance speech. So what, I always said he was full of
shit. Like Abe zLincoln compared to this guy though.
Can you stay on topic at all? Also, promising shit you cant deliver to people who have been
screwed is just demagoguery.
Those jobs which have been going away since the 80’s aren’t coming back any more than passenger train service using steam locomotives is.
If you like your doctor, insurance, and healthcare you can keep it. Really want to go there?
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If I had been a fan of Barrycare I wouldn’t. Since I wasn’t, sure why not.
He is selling the same kind of dishonest snake oil.
So you support China's healthcare system? Can I get an f'ing patriot in this f'ing place or what!!?
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Way to go PA Boy. It’s about time. Some patriotism.
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You keep proving the point. How’s about yer pals W and Vice? They do anything?
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I’ll repeat again they did nothing just like Obama. Right stay on China today.
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Like you I can support leaders when I agree and against them when I don’t. On China he’s right.
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Unpossible
Or should I say
They need someone to fight with all the time. No one here is praising or supporting China.
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Excuse me but I remember several posters claiming that Trump taking on China would hurt America.
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You can note the grass is green and that is not saying the tree leaves aren't green.
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Take another hit. You might make more sense.
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Read it again. English is not your first language
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Same old same old.
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That is supporting China?
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No but had Obama taken on China which he didn’t do in eight years he would be applauded. Right?
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And it is.......why do think yer Messiah just pulled back and blinked?
How is that supporting China?
Art of the Deal baby watch and learn
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Which deal? Has he gotten one in 3 years?
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Tax cuts, new NAFTA, getting NATO partners to pay more, energy independence. Not bad.
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New NAFTA still in limbo and it does virtually nothing. Fracking has been going on for years. He
has hardly made us energy independent. And there was no deal involved with it. The tax cut is a long term disaster debt wise. There was also no deal there with another side as his party controlled Congress.
I will give him defense costs, but that’s it. Pretty pathetic actually.
So Canada and Mexico want it but because it’s Trump it’s bad. It’s not just fracking dopey.
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Nope, it just doesn’t do much which is why I assume they want it.
Oil independence is almost entirely shale fracking.
The only thing you know about oil is filing your SUV with gasoline.
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Considering my firm handles oil and gas leasing I would say you are full of shit.
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Considering my company trades petroleum and owns terminals I’m glad I gave a good law firm
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After reading some of yer stuff here, I’m glad you have one as well.
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Stay on China!
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As Jim Cramer (no Trumpite) and Mr. Wonderful made clear last week, China is a totalitarian state
that has ripped us off for decades. It doesn't need Developing Nation status anymore. We don't need their goddamn market when they're waging a non-declared war in the Pacific. They can go pound sand. "Finally, an administration that's batting for the guy that puts his capital up there and gets screwed over and over and over and over again. Enough already, let's fix it!"
Amen. Pathetic spineless weak troglodyte troll people oppose Trump on this.
Thanks Capt Obvious. And that poor guy who put the capital up didn’t know all that?
Like all of our borrowers selling bonds to them didn’t know that?
Like all of our business trying to exploit their economy end formerly cheap labor didn’t know that?
Such a whiny pussy.
You're effectively saying that we should let China keep stealing our capital. You are lost in your
Trump hatred.
No, that’s not effectively what I’m saying.
I am saying that we made our own mess with them and it’s going to take some time to get out of it.
When you make pacts with the devil they come back to haunt you.
And ours with them to borrow so we could live beyond our means and use their cheap labor is exploding in our face.
WTF? Even Orange isn’t condemning them right now.
He’s right got once.
Orange Man Bad!!!
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Why do you keep saying bad? Well beyond that into terrible, horrendous.
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I agree he is AWOL for the time being I hope.
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You are making zero sense on this topic.
The initial discussion was about condemning China over Hong Kong. I pointed out that for once I agreed with Orange that it isn’t a good idea right now.
You now want to equate disagreement with the need to fight an immediate existential trade war with China to support of China.
Repeat, no one supports China. There is disagreement over the best policy to deal with them.
My point is I have yet to see a post from you anti Trumpers on anything related to China. True?
That is positive. Everything is a criticism without accepting the fact that China is a tough nut to crack.
WTF? There have been posts all over this subject and the trade war.
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Supporting Trump from you and your compadres? Show me.
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You must be taking English lessons from Eli. You first asked about “any posts related to China”.
I said there have been plenty.
You now switch up to posts supporting Orange.
Ironically enough though, I did just post that I agree with the Orange stain in not condemning them right now over Hong Kong. I also agree on pulling back on the tariffs. Also on labeling them a currency manipulator.
Just a thought experiment.
If we didn't agree with Trump, why would we support him?
Again, just a thought experiment. I haven't taken a stand on this trade war business.
Journey/Boston bad, Grateful Dead/Radiohead good.
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Is there actually any difference between Journey/Boston/Foreigner?
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Foreigner the best of that group. You are either too hot blooded or cold as ice to realize that.
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Boston is the tallest midget!
There were some decent guitar hooks in that first album.
Foreigner never cheesed out as far as Journey did, though. I'll give you that.
Here's some more cheese
Styx.
I liked Grand Illusion when it came out. Now I am embarrassed I ever did.
Contrast Kansas. I like them also as a pre-teen, but I still think a lot of it awesome.
I can't stop believing there is. It's more than a hot blooded feeling.
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Toto lly.
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Toto bullsh!t, Jim!
Toto, and Supertramp are outside of that group, but perhaps not by too much.
You've been standing too long in the rains of Africa. Find some dry land dude.
It's only logical Supertramp isn't on any list that is = great prog rock bands.
But do come in from the rain
Africa is the dumbest song ever - nice tune, beyond stupid lyrics
Here's some great lyrics.
More great lyrics