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The Army - Navy game controversy - The OK hand signal now a White Power hand signal?

Author: jimbasil (52634 Posts - Joined: Nov 15, 2007)

Posted at 1:00 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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Touching the thumb and index finger to make a circle, with the remaining three fingers held outstretched, is a gesture that people around the world have made for centuries, mostly in positive contexts. It is used for several purposes in sign languages, and in yoga as a symbol to demonstrate inner perfection.

It figures in an innocuous made-you-look game. Most of all, it has been commonly used for generations to signal “OK,” or all is well.

But in recent years, it has also been appropriated for a more malign purpose — to signify “white power.” The gesture has become an extremist meme, according to the Anti-Defamation League.

Now, officials at West Point and Annapolis are investigating whether cadets and midshipmen who made the sign with their hands during television coverage of the Army-Navy football game Saturday were doing so to express racist sentiments.

Here is how the hand gesture became a fraught one.

Where did the sign come from?

The widely understood modern use of the gesture for approval or assent seems to have arisen along with the term “OK” in the 19th century. Some researchers have traced the word to 1839, when Charles Gordon Greene wrote jokingly in The Boston Morning Post about it being an intentionally misspelled abbreviation for “all correct.” The term caught on, and the hand gesture, with the fingers forming something vaguely like an O and K, became closely linked with it.

How did it become connected to “white power”?

It started in early 2017 as a hoax. Some users of 4chan, an anonymous and unrestricted online message board, began what they called “Operation O-KKK,” to see if they could trick the wider world — and especially, liberals and the mainstream media — into believing that the innocuous gesture was actually a clandestine symbol of white power.

“We must flood twitter and other social media websites with spam, claiming that the OK hand signal is a symbol of white supremacy,” one of the users posted, going on to suggest that everyone involved create fake social media accounts “with basic white girl names” to propagate the notion as widely as possible.

The 4chan hoax succeeded all too well and ceased being a hoax: Neo-Nazis, Ku Klux Klansmen and other white nationalists began using the gesture in public to signal their presence and to spot potential sympathizers and recruits. For them, the letters formed by the hand were not O and K, but W and P, for “white power.”

The gesture is not the only symbol to have been appropriated and swiftly weaponized by alt-right internet trolls. The Southern Poverty Law Center has identified memes featuring the hoax religion of “Kek” and cartoon character Pepe the Frog, among others, as being at the forefront of white nationalists’ efforts to distract and infuriate liberals.

Where else has the gesture surfaced?

A number of high-profile figures on the far right have helped spread the gesture’s racist connotation by flashing it conspicuously in public, including Milo Yiannopolous, an outspoken former Breitbart editor, and Richard Spencer, one of the promoters of the white power rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, in 2017 that resulted in the death of a 32-year-old woman.

The gesture was in the headlines again after Roger Stone, a longtime political adviser to President Donald Trump, met with a group of white nationalists known as Proud Boys in Salem, Oregon, in 2018 and was photographed displaying it with them.

Critics expressed outrage when a former White House aide, Zina Bash, appeared to be flashing the sign as she sat behind Brett Kavanaugh during his televised Senate confirmation hearings for his appointment to the Supreme Court. Defenders of Bash insisted that she had not intended any racist connotation and was merely signaling OK to someone.

That the gesture has migrated beyond ironic trolling culture to become a “sincere expression of white supremacy,” according to the Anti-Defamation League, could be seen in March 2019 when Brenton Tarrant, the white supremacist accused of killing 50 people in back-to-back mass shootings at two mosques in Christchurch, New Zealand, smiled and flashed the sign to reporters at a court hearing on his case.

Some people who have used the gesture publicly in a way that seemed to suggest support for racist views have faced consequences. In 2018, the U.S. Coast Guard suspended an officer who appeared to use the sign on camera during an MSNBC broadcast. Later that year, four police officers in Jasper, Alabama, were suspended after a photo was published showing them flashing the sign below the waist.

And over the summer, a baseball fan was barred indefinitely from Wrigley Field in Chicago after making the gesture behind NBC sports commentator Doug Glanville during a broadcast of a Cubs game.

This article originally appeared in The New York Times.

© 2019 The New York Times Company


Jack, he is a banker
and Jane, she is a clerk

Replies to: The Army - Navy game controversy - The OK hand signal now a White Power hand signal?


Thread Level: 2

This entire thing started as a 4chan trolling job, and the left took the bait and ran away with it.

Author: jakers (13888 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 2:14 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

It does not mean that. It never did. And the actions during the game were part of "the circle game." It's been around for awhile - really not hard for any basic journalist to google, but they know this and want to keep fanning the flames.

Thread Level: 3

WTF is 4chan?

Author: Frank L (64681 Posts - Joined: Sep 20, 2007)

Posted at 4:01 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

Thread Level: 3

By "the left" you mean the KKK and neo nazis, right?

Author: jimbasil (52634 Posts - Joined: Nov 15, 2007)

Posted at 2:23 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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And of course, social media is only used by those on the left.

Jack, he is a banker
and Jane, she is a clerk
Thread Level: 4

Great point - the Klan and nazis were both leftist groups.

Author: jakers (13888 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 4:35 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

Thread Level: 5

You are often a joke but you outdid yourself here.

Author: Frank L (64681 Posts - Joined: Sep 20, 2007)

Posted at 6:59 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

Thread Level: 4

You are right. They're everywhere. You can not be too careful these days...

Author: TakethetrainKnute (33495 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 2:30 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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biden-gaffe-packwood-women.jpg

https://dmlnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/ftimg_report-bernie-sanders-accused-of-sexist-attack-on-liz-cheney-_2019-01-05T1233570000.jpg

Thread Level: 5

Exactly

Author: jimbasil (52634 Posts - Joined: Nov 15, 2007)

Posted at 3:09 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

http://www.breitbartunmasked.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/trumpsmallhands.jpg

Jack, he is a banker
and Jane, she is a clerk
Thread Level: 6

Much too small to be of any concern...

Author: TakethetrainKnute (33495 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 3:53 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

Thread Level: 7

At least they had to fake Trump's pic, Bernie and Creepy are obviously racist..

Author: BaronVonZemo (59926 Posts - Joined: Nov 19, 2010)

Posted at 4:43 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

Thread Level: 3

Remember when George Bush saluted Satan at the inaugural parade?

Author: NedoftheHill (44670 Posts - Joined: Jun 29, 2011)

Posted at 2:19 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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The sad thing is that Texas Longhorn fans do it all the time. Maybe when the state turns blue, they can eradicate this behavior.

https://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2005-01/22/xin_42010222094415610755.jpg

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Evil preaches tolerance until it is dominant, then it tries to silence good.
Thread Level: 2

Their Commander in Chief broadcasts the same message w/ his red hat —

Author: conorlarkin (21014 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 1:52 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

https://www.mercurynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/SJM-Z-Trump-12141-1.jpg?w=620

The American Dream belongs to all of us. — Kamala Harris
Thread Level: 3

No. MAGA means to go back to core American principles of capitalism and free trade and America first

Author: BaronVonZemo (59926 Posts - Joined: Nov 19, 2010)

Posted at 3:49 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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Not that you want to believe it, but I just want to put this out there to prevent your fake claim from being uncountered.

Thread Level: 4

I never knew that.

Author: conorlarkin (21014 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 3:54 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single



The American Dream belongs to all of us. — Kamala Harris
Thread Level: 5

And, Democrats have used the phrase in the past. Amazing, right?

Author: NedoftheHill (44670 Posts - Joined: Jun 29, 2011)

Posted at 12:30 pm on Dec 17, 2019
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(no message)

Evil preaches tolerance until it is dominant, then it tries to silence good.
Thread Level: 3

I have to admit, it is a good strategy for the left to take good/neutral things, and make them evil.

Author: NedoftheHill (44670 Posts - Joined: Jun 29, 2011)

Posted at 2:20 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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Riles up your base...and they need riling.

Evil preaches tolerance until it is dominant, then it tries to silence good.
Thread Level: 4

"Make America Great Again" and "Build that Wall" are bat signals for racists.

Author: conorlarkin (21014 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 3:14 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

Again, voting for Trump does not make one a racist.

Yet, Trump knew there is a chunk of the electorate who are easy targets for fear mongering -- quick to blame immigrants and minorities for their own shortcomings.

On the heels of President Barack Obama's 8 years in office, "Make America Great Again" has only one meaning.

Anyone with any degree of street smarts understands the message.


The American Dream belongs to all of us. — Kamala Harris
Thread Level: 5

Total nonsense. But, again, it is a good political strategy for your guys to say that.

Author: NedoftheHill (44670 Posts - Joined: Jun 29, 2011)

Posted at 9:13 am on Dec 17, 2019
View Single

Sadly, identity politics, if successful in allowing you to hold power, will inevitably destroy the country. So, that is unfortunate.

This message has been edited 2 time(s).

Evil preaches tolerance until it is dominant, then it tries to silence good.
Thread Level: 5

What % of Orange supporters do you reckon to be white supremacists?

Author: Frank L (64681 Posts - Joined: Sep 20, 2007)

Posted at 4:00 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

While some of his bot like supporters make me shake my head, I don’t see that many white supremacy peeps in his base. Not to say there aren’t some, or that those that are don’t support him.

Thread Level: 6

Frank like Tom Hagen is not a war time Consigliere,butt boy for Obama and HRC

Author: eftg1 (12936 Posts - Joined: Sep 19, 2012)

Posted at 4:33 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 6

Racists and white supremacists are not equivalent.

Author: conorlarkin (21014 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 4:12 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

My guess is that 30-35 % of Trump's voters were most influenced by their racist beliefs (conscious or subconscious).

My guess is that < 1-2% of his voters would fall in the "white supremacist" camp.


The American Dream belongs to all of us. — Kamala Harris
Thread Level: 7

Agree there is a difference and with the 1-2% figure.

Author: Frank L (64681 Posts - Joined: Sep 20, 2007)

Posted at 10:22 am on Dec 17, 2019
View Single

I think you are too simplistic on the 30-35% being influenced by race.

One of the significant reasons Orange won in the battleground states was that he was able to flip blue collar whites who had voted for Barry. Google up Luzerne and Washington Counties in PA if you want the confirmation.

You think Joe Biden would have lost those counties? Lots more than race in play that were primary motivating factors.


This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 7

What percentage of HRC voters do you think were most influenced by their racist beliefs?

Author: NedoftheHill (44670 Posts - Joined: Jun 29, 2011)

Posted at 9:29 am on Dec 17, 2019
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(no message)

Evil preaches tolerance until it is dominant, then it tries to silence good.
Thread Level: 7

Can you give me an example of an unconscious racist belief?

Author: NedoftheHill (44670 Posts - Joined: Jun 29, 2011)

Posted at 9:15 am on Dec 17, 2019
View Single

(no message)

Evil preaches tolerance until it is dominant, then it tries to silence good.
Thread Level: 4

Right, becuase the Left wear red hats with MAGA written on them.

Author: jimbasil (52634 Posts - Joined: Nov 15, 2007)

Posted at 2:24 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

(no message)

Jack, he is a banker
and Jane, she is a clerk
Thread Level: 5

Not THAT would REALLY make the red hats evil!

Author: NedoftheHill (44670 Posts - Joined: Jun 29, 2011)

Posted at 2:38 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

With black shirts?...or at least the black masks you guys like to wear?

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Evil preaches tolerance until it is dominant, then it tries to silence good.
Thread Level: 5

It's "KAG" for 2020. Gotta keep current...

Author: TakethetrainKnute (33495 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 2:37 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

(no message)

Thread Level: 3

Without a doubt. Trump is the worst of us.

Author: jimbasil (52634 Posts - Joined: Nov 15, 2007)

Posted at 2:02 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

(no message)

Jack, he is a banker
and Jane, she is a clerk
Thread Level: 2

O...boy

Author: TakethetrainKnute (33495 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 1:31 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

Some goofballs coopt one of the most commonly used hand signals there is...and now everyone who uses it is now a white supremacist?

I would say that safely 98% of people know nothing about this.


http://memecrunch.com/meme/4YI5C/otay/image.png?w=400&c=1

This message has been edited 1 time(s).

Thread Level: 2

No way this kid was thinking that way.

Author: Chris94 (36755 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 1:18 pm on Dec 16, 2019
View Single

In my day, when you tricked someone into looking into that ring, you got to punch them for some reason.*



*replace "you" with "douchebags" and you'll get a more accurate sentence.


Thread Level: 3

Exactly (on both points).

Author: jakers (13888 Posts - Original UHND Member)

Posted at 2:15 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

Thread Level: 3

I never heard of that okay sign or either story. But yours makes more sense.

Author: Frank L (64681 Posts - Joined: Sep 20, 2007)

Posted at 2:11 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

Thread Level: 2

I would certainly hope not. If it is, we have real problems.

Author: Frank L (64681 Posts - Joined: Sep 20, 2007)

Posted at 1:05 pm on Dec 16, 2019
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(no message)

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